Can I put 2000w through my 1000w hub motor?

[drifta303]

Hey all, I have one of the 1000w hub motor kits bought on online special in australia recently, it doesn't seem to have a brand but it's the common black style shape that looks like mxus but I'm guessing wouldn't be as good quality.

Anyways I've set it up on my drift trike for fwd power and respoked the 26 down to 20" but I'd still like more torque & power

Can I add another 48v pack and with a different speed controller run it at 96v? (2000w)?

I was about to buy a 52v pack but then thought hey I wonder if I can just double the power

 

[nutnspecial]

Yes, you can. I think the controller will need 4115 fets.

So how many series' cells are we talkin? 24?
Will the voltage range put you into the speed range you want for that 20" wheel?

If it ends up being too tall of gearing, you might wanna up the amps from the 20-25a it seems you're thinking of staying with. At that point you wanna be extra careful of overheating.

What does the motor weigh?

 

[teslanv]

Hey all, I have one of the 1000w hub motor kits bought on online special in australia recently, it doesn't seem to have a brand but it's the common black style shape that looks like mxus but I'm guessing wouldn't be as good quality.

Anyways I've set it up on my drift trike for fwd power and respoked the 26 down to 20" but I'd still like more torque & power

Can I add another 48v pack and with a different speed controller run it at 96v? (2000w)?

I was about to buy a 52v pack but then thought hey I wonder if I can just double the power

Typically, motors are rated for the maximum power they can sustain continually. If it's a direct drive hub motor, you can run it at much higher power (2-3 times the rated voltage and Current) for brief periods, but the higher phase current you push to it, the faster it will reach the critical temperature (generally about 130 degrees Celsius before really bad things start to happen.)

Most "1000W" DD Hubs can take 2000 to 3000 Watts for maybe 10 minutes.

I would recommend starting your upgrade with 20S Lithium (74V Nominal) and a 40A rated controller. A good 12FET IRFB4110 controller would do nicely. Most likely, that motor is a 9X7T winding, and you can use the "NineCont 2807" motor in the ebikes simulator to simulate the performance.

 

[BeachRider2016]

Hey all, I have one of the 1000w hub motor kits bought on online special in australia recently, it doesn't seem to have a brand but it's the common black style shape that looks like mxus but I'm guessing wouldn't be as good quality.

Anyways I've set it up on my drift trike for fwd power and respoked the 26 down to 20" but I'd still like more torque & power

Can I add another 48v pack and with a different speed controller run it at 96v? (2000w)?

I was about to buy a 52v pack but then thought hey I wonder if I can just double the power

Typically, motors are rated for the maximum power they can sustain continually. If it's a direct drive hub motor, you can run it at much higher power (2-3 times the rated voltage and Current) for brief periods, but the higher phase current you push to it, the faster it will reach the critical temperature (generally about 130 degrees Celsius before really bad things start to happen.)

Most "1000W" DD Hubs can take 2000 to 3000 Watts for maybe 10 minutes.

I would recommend starting your upgrade with 20S Lithium (74V Nominal) and a 40A rated controller. A good 12FET IRFB4110 controller would do nicely. Most likely, that motor is a 9X7T winding, and you can use the "NineCont 2807" motor in the ebikes simulator to simulate the performance.

Would speed improve with higher voltage ? My 1kw hub seems to max out (13s/54v) at 32mph. Phase wires real warm if i push 2kw constant, but torque is way better than at 1kw.

 

[nutnspecial]

Yes, voltage increases speed via greater motor rpm just like using a larger diameter wheel increases speed by a taller gearing reduction from motor shaft to the road.

x% more voltage = x% more rpm

20s on your bike would take you to almost 50mph if the motor can sustain your duty cycle/use.

 

[Punx0r]

Most hub motors can be spun as fast as you like for a typical bike-sized wheel (road speed becomes crazy before the motor speed gets high enough to result in significant core losses) so they tend to be torque/current limited by overheating. 2000W @ 96V is only around 20A (phase not battery!), which is within the continuous rating of your motor, so go nuts.

I wouldn't hit it with less than 80A phase current (probably more like 100A), which will give you much more torque.

 

[dogman dan]

New controller,, 72v 40 amps. 3000w. they can be cheap on ebay. My experience has been that pushing them harder, 4000w+ will literally start to overheat in 10 min.

But 72v 40 amps,, I was able to get about 10 laps on a one lap track before heat got really bad with 3000w. Call it 30 min run time, pushing it hard the whole way, not cruising. Vent the cover. It may not cool it much while running, but it will prevent the heat spike when you stop, that cooks your halls.

Get a bigger motor though, if you really want speed, and 100v.

 

[drifta303]

To give some more details I currently have a 48v battery rated for this speed controller (20-25a?)

I was considering going to 52v for more power w existing kit but then thought I could get another identical 48v batt and either double the Amps or volts, but would need to change the controller..


Better to push amps or volts?

Torque is more important than speed for my drifts

 

[John in CR]

Great choice re-spoking it into a 20" rim. The smaller wheel will allow you to dial up both current and voltage for much greater power. How far you can go with a specific motor depends on total loads and how you ride. Load comes in 2 primary forms, the combined weight of bike, rider and cargo, and then there's uphill grades. Big loads require lower current limits than lighter loads. It's impossible for anyone to recommend a reliable power limit for you without knowing your total load and the terrain you ride, but of course that won't stop people from offering advice in the blind.

How you ride is important too, because almost any system without automatic thermal shutdown or current cutback can be pushed to thermal failure simply by doing enough repetitive hard launches or climbing steep enough hills unless you've built in safeguards to prevent heat failure. Learn your motor's limits.

 

[teslanv]

It's impossible for anyone to recommend a reliable power limit for you without knowing your total load and the terrain you ride, but of course that won't stop people from offering advice in the blind.

How you ride is important too, because almost any system without automatic thermal shutdown or current cutback can be pushed to thermal failure simply by doing enough repetitive hard launches or climbing steep enough hills unless you've built in safeguards to prevent heat failure. Learn your motor's limits.

Upgrading the phase wire size to 10AWG or even 8AWG right up to where they enter the axle is a good & easy way to minimize the resistance losses.

The best way to find your motor's limits is to increase power until it fails. Nothing like releasing the magic smoke on your first 1000W Ebay hub to get a good sense of what they can handle. At least they are cheap and easy to swap the stator out. :wink:

 

[dogman dan]

I'm definitely a convert, to 20" rims for the motor wheel of bikes for the street. A real world of difference, at any size motor.

No doubt about it,, the fun thing about these cheaper 28mm motors, is you can afford to melt several of em, or at least cook off the halls. I used to run 3000w on them all winter, then when I cooked one, swap on another and lower the watts for summer use. By next spring, i'd have new halls in the one I fried last spring.

But that got tiresome,, now I run just 2000w, in a much bigger motor, and never cook it.

 

[MadRhino]

...the fun thing about these cheaper 28mm motors, is you can afford to melt several of em

I gathered half a trash can of fried HS-3540. I am not sure that I can afford frying some 28mm atop of them. :|

I am done with small motors, even when they are free the hassle to replace them is too much riding time lost.

 

[BeachRider2016]

Its easy to mod the controllers shun to up amperage by just solder a solid wire between the existing shuns. Amperage easily doubled. 52v pack wont help much. I run 13s at full charge 54v full throttle at 32mph. At 48v its 30mph. Torque about the same however after shun modded it drained twice as much amperage and torque shot up noticably.

I kept pushing 2kw+ and hard startup draw up to 3.4kw, now one or all of my halls is fried. It stutters and wont run from standing still unless I give it a push. My controller works without halls, so now i guess i will run until i see smokes