CYC Photon wit SW102 Display- way to do factory reset without phone app?

[offgrid]

Just powered up a new Photon and took a ride, and everything worked well.
Then started up the app on my android phone and started to program stuff, and everything worked well. Except the display timed off, and the BT link disconnected and I get the ERROR 26 hall effect fault at start up on the display.

Now the app wont connect on BT, showing a Connection Timeout.
Is there a way to do a factory reset with just the display?

Thanks very much,
Tim

 

[raylo32]

Not that I have seen. I have a different issue with my Photon or its display and I looked to do the exact thing. Nope.

One thing you could try if you haven't already is to delete the app, reinstall it, then try again to connect it to the motor via BT.

 

[offgrid]

Thanks Raylo, I did try to delete and reinstall the app. Also disconnected the battery and disconnected the speed sensor and display. I checked the pins for still being straight, and then reconnected everything. The BT app will still not connect and now everything is not working on the motor, both throttle (on all speeds) and pedal assist are dead. The speed sensor is not registering mph on the display anymore, speed sensor LED is not working, and at power up. I'm still getting the ERROR 26 on the display about 5 seconds after powerup.
I am talking to the vendor Electrify Bike about the problem but that seems slow going, and I've yet to get an answer from them about the factory reset.

Oh yeah one other weirdity. The Google Pixel phone shows two BT entities on the bike. I'll show a picture of the screen below, and if I try to connect to CYCMOTOR, I get the "Connection timeout" fault show in graphic above. If I connect to the Tophmi, the display instantly turns off and in either case the app will not connect. Weird right?

Tim

 

[raylo32]

Good luck with Electrify. They are great on sales, not so much on support if and when you have a real problem. It is going to be painful for you, I am afraid. And there appear to be several cases of odd things happening with the firmware that they and even CYC haven't seen before. That could make getting it fixed even slower. What they should be doing is replacing these things that are defective out of the box and taking the bad ones back for analysis so the problem can be fixed permanently. And I agree, CYC really should figure out a way to have a reset ability on the display.

 

[offgrid]

Oh that is interesting. I have purchased from them before without issue, but it's been a while. I agree with you, it should be an instant RMA with a replacement on the way. That would help THEM determine what the defects are and how to prevent them in the future.

And yeah, a reset to factory needs to be added to the base unit, typical hold down on all the switches at powerup for 20 seconds, type of thing. (yeah I have tried various versions of that by the way!)

They have said that they are now out of stock again, so that might be a while.
What vendors have been good to the DIY crowd?
Thanks
Tim

 

[raylo32]

Just my 2 cents based on a less serious issue I am having with my Photon. I am not here to bash a vendor but their e-mail only support is inadequate, IMO. Slow, can get ignored, you end up covering and re-covering already plowed ground, etc. And beyond their control, the demand for these is greater than the supply so shipping out replacements in reasonable time might be impossible... unless they intentionally keep some back for that purpose... which would hurt profits.

Thing is I have never had an e-bike motor issue that required going back to a vendor. I have a TSDZ2 which is totally DIY... you get the parts, you download the firmware and fix your issues yourself. I also have a CYC X1 Pro Gen 2 bike that has never had any problems. My Photon firmware issue was the first one ever that I could not just fix and, worse, had to go to the vendor and not the mfg. to get it resolved. I'm sorry, to TRY to get it resolved. Not there yet.

Other vendors?? IDK. I have always had good luck with Eco Cycles in Nashville. But they seem to be offline right now supposedly due to e-commerce development issues, but IDK. They've been down for awhile and don't respond to requests for status. Some other folks mention Bicycle Motor Works in PA. But I have no experience.

 

[raylo32]

One more thing... make sure you have the correct CYC app, "Ride Control". There is an older app for the previous gen motors with BAC controllers. The icons on the app stores look the same.

 

[offgrid]

yeah Ride Control is the only one I could find, and it's specified in the Photon how-to-build video on the CYC site.
Personally, I prefer email tech support, because then I have all the documentation for the repair/return, whatever it is. And it doesn't have to be slow, but I notice a lot of companies are basically doing a one email per day thing, so resolution can take forever. What exact problem are you having with the firmware? Is it something that could be fixed with a factory reset? Maybe we need to write a request to CYC to add that to new firmware? Plug in battery 3 times, and hold the display power switch for 20 seconds. Easy and peasy.
t

 

[raylo32]

Mine is relatively minor. I just can't select wheel size in the display menu. The display or motor firmware has that locked onto 29". My first thought was to reset or reflash the display, like we do all the time for TSDZ2. But nope. It's not in there. So, I did the reset in the app but that didn't help at all. That just seemed to reset the app itself so I had to go recreate all my custom settings. Waste of time. I also installed the updated CYC app and flashed the newest firmware. That didn't help either. But at least the new app has the ability to flash firmware, something that v1 lacked.

As for e-mail support, yes it can be good, at least to start. Unfortunately, my first request got ignored for 3 weeks except for the automated response that said be patient and respond only to the e-mail that comes and not start a new one. But I had to start a new one after all. Then got into a back and forth on irrelevant things and things I had already tried. A phone call at that point would have dispensed with a lot of this stuff. Then they said they were having a call with CYC and would tell me "what the path forward is IF there is one". LOL. IF?? Never got any feedback from that meeting, so I replied to the email string to ask for an update... and that was ignored so I had to start yet another initial request. All I think I know now is that there is some bug CYC are working on, but why and how my motor is the only one that seems to have it, you tell me. No one else here has such an issue.

Oh well. At least my motor is functional otherwise. And I can make changes to all the other menu settings in the display except wheel size. I assume the other data besides those that rely on wheel circumference on the display are reasonably accurate but who knows.

yeah Ride Control is the only one I could find, and it's specified in the Photon how-to-build video on the CYC site.
Personally, I prefer email tech support, because then I have all the documentation for the repair/return, whatever it is. And it doesn't have to be slow, but I notice a lot of companies are basically doing a one email per day thing, so resolution can take forever. What exact problem are you having with the firmware? Is it something that could be fixed with a factory reset? Maybe we need to write a request to CYC to add that to new firmware? Plug in battery 3 times, and hold the display power switch for 20 seconds. Easy and peasy.
t

 

[offgrid]

All I think I know now is that there is some bug CYC are working on, but why and how my motor is the only one that seems to have it, you tell me. No one else here has such an issue.

Actually I have the same issue, in combination with all the other problems. When I first had the app work, I was able to change the value to 26 inch, my bike value, but now the app won't connect and the display also is stuck at 29. Can you not change the value in the app?
Actually I have an apology to do, I'm only on the forum for fixing this problem, I've been a lurker for years. But it did seem like I might have something that could help others in the future.

I'm in a holding pattern with my vendor too, waiting for a refund but the vendor said "I'm going to turn this over to shipping and let them discuss it with CYC and see what they want to do."
I'm maybe crazy though because I went an bought another Photon from another vendor, since I do believe in the concept if not the execution so far. Call me nuts but I will win in the end (he says with a smirk!)

t

 

[offgrid]

I feel like I should have more than 10uW. I used to design inverters at Trace, Xantrex, Magnum and probably have 100's of MW of products in the field!
Magnum Energy MS4048-20BL - Inverter Supply

 

[amberwolf]

I feel like I should have more than 10uW.

Post more, and it goes up. Mine is high because I post everyday helping people out.

 

[raylo32]

If you have the new app it says you can only make persistent changes to wheel size for X1 and Stealth Gen 3 motors that have X6 controllers. In the first version of the app it did not have that proviso, so I tried that and would sometimes get a message to make sure to also change it in the display.... which of course didn't and doesn't work due to whatever bug this is. So, no, for Photon you need to make this setting on the display.

Actually I have the same issue, in combination with all the other problems. When I first had the app work, I was able to change the value to 26 inch, my bike value, but now the app won't connect and the display also is stuck at 29. Can you not change the value in the app?

 

[raylo32]

As AW says, post more and you'll gain watts. I am sorry to hear how the vendor is treating you. But after my experience I am not surprised. These things should be RMA'ed and replaced. But at least my motor runs... at least for now.

Actually I have the same issue, in combination with all the other problems. When I first had the app work, I was able to change the value to 26 inch, my bike value, but now the app won't connect and the display also is stuck at 29. Can you not change the value in the app?
Actually I have an apology to do, I'm only on the forum for fixing this problem, I've been a lurker for years. But it did seem like I might have something that could help others in the future.

I'm in a holding pattern with my vendor too, waiting for a refund but the vendor said "I'm going to turn this over to shipping and let them discuss it with CYC and see what they want to do."
I'm maybe crazy though because I went an bought another Photon from another vendor, since I do believe in the concept if not the execution so far. Call me nuts but I will win in the end (he says with a smirk!)

t

 

[offgrid]

post more and you'll gain watts

That was my very lame attempt at a joke, and then looking back I see it's just a selfish brag! Anyhoo, I'm pulling off the old to get ready for the new. Golden Motor said they were in stock, and the new Photon should be shipped this week. I've got a ride coming up I really really want the new kit for, so I'm hopeful if a little bit worried that all will go well.
Thanks for all the help Ray, it's been nice to have a sanity check for the CYC stuff. Next kit I'm leaving in factory default mode until the app settles down a bit, and when that does happen, I download the app and go for custom settings. It isn't coincidental that my issues started with the display timing off when I was doing some setting changes with the app, I don't think.

Edit: Just heard from Electrify bike and have return shipping label in hand! I'm pleased they responded to my request quickly.


t

 

[raylo32]

I agree it might be an issue of making settings from the app that messed something up. IIRC I tried setting the wheel diameter in the app first.. when I also got the message to also change the setting in the display... and maybe that is what screwed that setting up in the controller and display. And the new app specifically says that this setting only works for Stealth and X1. Luckily I have had no other issues. The new app connects and I can adjust all the other settings. And the motor seems to ride normally.

Good for you getting a return. So, Golden Motors has Photons in stock? I want to do another build but I canceled my order for that kit from Electrify. I am not going to do any more business with them unless and until I get my Photon working 100% properly... or returned for a replacement or refund.

Thanks for all the help Ray, it's been nice to have a sanity check for the CYC stuff. Next kit I'm leaving in factory default mode until the app settles down a bit, and when that does happen, I download the app and go for custom settings. It isn't coincidental that my issues started with the display timing off when I was doing some setting changes with the app, I don't think.

Edit: Just heard from Electrify bike and have return shipping label in hand! I'm pleased they responded to my request quickly.
View attachment 337980

t

 

[offgrid]

Golden said they were in stock. I'll let you know when it ships!
t

 

[raylo32]

The only possible issue with this is depending on how the vendor or factory configured it... and they would have had to do that with the app... the speed limits may not be to your liking. For sure street mode will be limited to 16mph. And Race could maybe be 20 on conservative settings. You'd need the app to adjust those settings as they are not found in the display. And you'd also need the app to make it unrestricted so you can just do whatever you want in either mode.

Next kit I'm leaving in factory default mode until the app settles down a bit

t

 

[offgrid]

Oh I figured the kit shipped in factory default mode from firmware. The battery voltage was wrong even though I ordered the kit and battery from same vendor. I can live with those defaults for a while to give some time for the app to settle. But I do have a feeling the bugs are in the motor/display code because of the timeout issue that caused my motor to brick, and the wheel size firmware issue we are both seeing, which is a whole 'nuther thing.
t

 

[offgrid]

I just heard directly from CYC, and they passed along some troubleshooting info that is partly new to me, and may be of used to other Photon users.

"Please check if your speed sensor is connected properly. The Bluetooth module is located in the speed sensor and so if it’s not plugged in on not connected nicely, it will not pick up. Then, ensure that your kit is switched on.
For the incorrect motor temperature reading, please reset all settings to default in the general settings section of the app."

t

 

[raylo32]

I believe most vendors allow you to specify if you want it unrestricted or not which would require them to use the app. But regardless, even if it comes from the factory with whatever settings, the factory probably had to make the initial settings the same way... via the app... as the vendor and as you. Or at least they tested the BT connection with the app. So the motor has already been successfully connected and/or flashed by the app. But maybe try to avoid those timeouts. IIRC the timeout time is adjustable in the display. Maybe make that a bit longer to be safe. Mine has timed out on me when I was connected with the app and it didn't brick it. But it may not have been when I was actually saving a setting. I am going to be really careful about that now.

Edit: yes, the timeout is adjustable in the display settings menu. Max of 10 minutes which is what I have mine set to. IIRC, it came originally set to 1 minute, which is ridiculous.

Oh I figured the kit shipped in factory default mode from firmware.
t

 

[offgrid]

Update on Photons in stock:
Golden Motor is shipping. Order placed on Saturday, Shipped Monday afternoon.
Kit was 42T, Thumb throttle, Sw102 display, 175mm crank, no other options.

 

[raylo32]

I will wait until you get this installed and report back how it all works, to include setting wheel diameter. Then maybe I'll order mine. I would probably get the exact same configuration which is the same as my current Photon. I had been considering getting the 50t chainring for this road/gravel bike build but based on the thermal performance I have seen on my other bike (42t chain ring, 26" wheels), I doubt I'd be able to really use the 50t to pedal at those 30+ MPH speeds for long without getting thermal throttling. So, it would likely be a waste.

 

[offgrid]

I ordered the 50t for the first installation and it was a little big for my Trek (frame size medium). It pushed the chain line outward too far, which would have necessitated a smaller rear cassette. I'm not really a speed demon, 28mph on the flat is just fine for me, so the 42t cog should be ok. It seems funny that you have a big metal (alum in my case) tube that you could conduct heat into to aid in cooling and non of the motors use that as additional eat sinking.
I've prepped the bike for the new kit, and so by Thursday night should have it up and running on whatever factory default mode it's in. I will def set the timeout on the display to OFF before doing any app programming. I might even wait for a week or 3 before I do that if I like the settings. I'll let you know if I can set the wheel diameter. I was able to do that in the first 10 minutes of the last kit by the way.

I also asked CYC for a reset to default with the display and motor, as a way to help troubleshoot problems in the field.

t

 

[offgrid]

Hi Ray,
I installed new Photon today and was able to change wheel sizes and so changed and saved 26 inch which is my wheel. Also heard back from CYC on reset to factory from the SW102 display.

"Thank you for your valuable suggestion.
I have passed the suggestion to our development team, they are reviewing it."

So that's it for now. Also I can say if Golden say they have stock, then they do have stock!
t