E-Backpack on my E-Bike

[Karl]

I am really excited. Yesturday, I was shopping for a slightly used Smart car because just in fuel I spend over 2700$ a tear (can) just to go to work!
I was making 35k a year. Now, a new job with 36k a year within 10km to work! HOW AWESOME IS THAT!
Reviving my E-Bike project.

As discussed before in another topic Dogman helped me figure out what I wanted and how I wanted it.

I am officially building an E-bike that I hope will travel 50km/h with my E-Backpack.

I will be using 16 x 7.4v 5AH LIPO from HobbyKing
for a 59.2v 10AH backpack

I will be using a ''Made in China'' 72v 1500W Controller that will be mounted on the bike
The Wheel motor will be a E-Bikekit.com 1000w on 26'' front wheel boosted with 59.2volts (Jason, from E-Bikekit.com, said it will work no problem.)

All the wires will be hidden in the frame.

As for the charger I am still unsure.. I am racing RC and I will be able to charge the 7.4 packs 1 by 1 but can I charge them as 1 pack? If so, how? Because it's a mistery to me.

Any Idea's?

 

[chroot]

Hi, I would recommend get 6 x 5s, it make 15s2p and it will be 61.5v (4.1v each cell). You will have no problem using
E-BikeKit controller (Don't let it over 63v or it will blow up the capacitors) unless you want get highly reputation and quality controller get Lyen's controller. He is best.

Lyen controller capable program setting, Direct plug CA (Cycle Anaylst), and also capable up to 100v not matter how low
or high volt as long as you use either Gary's LVC/HVC or Geoff's SMD LVC board when one of LiPo's cell hit 3v trigger cut off
via ebraking or throttle wire which saving your butt for not letting them into dead zone. You can get in touch with Lyen. His ID is Lyen and just PM him. He has 9, 12, 18, and 24 fets controller and lot choices!!

For the charger, 2 choices icharger with balancer or Meanwell charger with Gary's HVC board

Why not get Topeak bag with rack. It has quick disconnect the bag off the rack a second. It also keep weight off on you and less stress on your backbone due lot bumps or bad road. For your safety when your going use LiPo battery is highly violate and you wouldn't want these start fire in your back.

 

[Karl]

the Lipo cells are 3.2 nominal and 3.7 max voltage how do you end up at 61.5?
maybe we are not talking about the same batteries I am referring to Lithium polymer they willbe straped horizontally from top to bottom of the backpack with secured pockets for each batteries. The backpack will also be used for my trimmer, headge trimmer that is why I wanted to do it differently

why should I use this 63volt controller when I can get one running at 72?

I know stupid questions lol
thanks,

 

[chroot]

Hi-

Yes, it's relative called LiPo (Lithium Polymer) from Hobbyking and They are rated 3.7v Nominal - 4.2v Maxmium per cell so 15x4.1=61.5v. I chose 4.1v because of longer lifetime on LiPo more cycle last long time.

You said "I will be using 16 x 7.4v 5AH LIPO from HobbyKing for a 59.2v 10AH backpack"

Can you give us refer your battery link or picture? Maybe you was referring to Li-Ion Polymer or LiFeP04 batteries are rated 3.2v nominal and maxmium 3.65v per cell.

I think we are confuse on the battery type. Sorry! Here info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-ion_polymer_battery

If you buy a EbikeKit kit and it comes with the controller. They are rated 63v max due capacitors's rated. As long as it's under 63v and your will be fine run Ebikekit's controller till whenever you are ready invest better controller capacity and powerful.

 

[Karl]

On my other topic people said Crystalyte are fast and strong motors and controllers to me it seems like a better quality

someone mentionned 40MPH easy... Basically I would love one of their kits. Where can I purchase one?

 

[chroot]

Yes, xlyte motor is so powerful than 9c motor hub. They cost more than 9c worth.

A Member name Icecube, he uses his xlyte 5303, running at 44 volt and ran 42mph easily. He also live in
lot hilly and surprised 5303 ran so fast uphill than 9c did. He weighted 250lbs as he mentioned in other discussion section.

DAMN!

 

[dogman dan]

If you sourced your motor from Ebikes-ca, you could get a faster 2806 motor. Less hill climbing ability at slow speeds, but a faster top speed.

But as I was saying on the other threads, the 2807 can be plenty fast, just throw enough volts at it, and the right lyens controller. Talk to Lyens, he can make you a controller with a jumper wire on it, that allows use at 48v, or 72v, or whatever. And have 100v caps etc so it doesn't blow up on ya for using 15s lipo. If you charge to 4.2v per cell, 15s will get you into the danger zone, right at 63v on the stock ebikeikit controller.

So I use a 14s lipo battery for my 48v controllers. Keeps the volts down to 60. Because my use is recreational, I charge my packs individualy or in paralell pairs.

Speeds on my racing bike with 2807 motor. 14s lipo 27 mph, 20s lipo 40 mph, 24s lipo 46 mph.

Nothing wrong with a crystalyte 5303. It's just heavier and more expensive and uses the battery up faster. But that's the price for having more power, and a longer run time before you overheat. Personally, I just found the extra ten pounds of weight on the wheel not worth it, for what I was doing. It's not exactly required for speed, but it still is the most powerfull and hardest to melt motor of the commonly avaliable hubmotors.

Answering the where to get question may depend on where you are. But Ebikes-ca does carry the 5304, and ships international.

 

[BLUESTREAK]

STEVEO can fix your e-bikekit.com controller to run 60volt batteryand not have any problems.

 

[Ykick]

I'm seeing more and more people talking about Lipo but they're actually looking at LiFeP04. 3.7v/cell max is likely the later...

I run 15S Lipo (the RC stuff) charged to 4.1V/cell - see around 62.4V hot off the charger. My e-bike-kit controller seems to exhibit no long term problems other than a nasty spark when connecting power. Pre-charge resistor solves that issue but once the plating burns away from the connector contacts, the spark doesn't seem to be as bad either...

For most stock controllers I'd suggest no more than 15S. 12S is a pretty good arrangement too, obviously not as fast but it's almost 1/3 the size/weight of 15S. 12S makes for a nice backup spare battery to stick in a backpack or saddlebag too.

 

[Karl]

I dont know if its me that explains it all wrong. But Yes, I am refering to R/C stuff.

My charger, R/C charger, charges 1 cell to 4.2 I cannot set the charger to 4.1...

Its 1s to 4.2, 2s to 8.4v...ETC....
How can you guys charge it to 4.1volts?

An R/C pack with maximum capacity of 5000MAH 7.4v will have 5000mah at 8.4 volts... No way a 5000mah pack will have that capacity at 7.4 or 8.2

Can I have further explainations?

I wanted to order 16 packs of Zippy 5200mAh 7.4v
to make a pack of 59.2v 10400mAh

Am I missing something?

 

[chroot]

Hi Karl,

Probably your charger is limited feature?

RC charger supposed have these label.

LiPo = 4.2v
Li-Ion = 4.1v
LiFeP04 = 3.65v
SLA = 14v
..
etc

I think you missed the voltage on RC stuff LiPo from Hobbyking does have 22v as 6s1p and for 5s1p 18.5v. I ask you WHY do you want use 2s1p LiPo battery? sound ridiculous instead get either 5s1p or 6s1p so few pack than many pack together in 2s battery. Easier for you disconnect and connect charger without hassle so many JST connectors, postive and negative connectors.


Here the link

5s1p LiPo battery
http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=8581

6s1p LiPo battery
http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=8582

Now, Dogman is right about the xlyte motor eat faster battery drain. Forgive me, I am in America using MPH speed and I didn't see your comment about 50km/h means around 31mph. OK 15s2p (10Ah) LiPo will take you 30+ easyly and run fine with Ebikekit controller because it's under 63v (4.1v x 15 = 61.5v). I believe that your rc charger does have "Li-Ion" but can you give us what brand and name of rc charger do you have now? Please double check your charger to see if you can find "Li-Ion" label which it will charge up to 4.1 per cell. Let us know!

 

[veloman]

It doesn't make sense to me to use 2s packs, why not use 6s packs and have 1/3 as many wires?


About the c-lyte, don't forget, I think those things weigh about 8-10lbs MORE than a 9c, or in the 22lb range.

 

[Karl]

Thanks now it makes more sence but to charge lipo under Lithium Ion will be fine? Sweet.

I have a Great plane Tritton EQ charger

and as for the 2s1p configuration may sound wierd its because I will be using these packs for R/C racing as well during the race days. I also thought the small 7.4v pack would be better to spread the mass equally on the surface of my back like this

with pockets made from elestic tissue

 

[dogman dan]

Look at some pix of 72v 10 ah wiring before you opt for a whole bunch of 2s packs. It's a LOT of wire and connectors just to string up 8 5s packs.

This is one of my 20s packs of 8 5s batteries.

I did it the hard way, so I have extra connectors there. I wanted to be able to string em up any way I want, paralell or series, without special adaptors.

You could run a compromise voltage, of 18s, using just 6 6s packs. Then occasionally add a few 2s packs and run 20s. (72v)

18s is just over halfway between 48v and 72v nominal. 6 of those 6s blocks would fit very nicely in a very small backpack.

 

[vanilla ice]

Word to dog, go with 6s packs, when batteries are as compact as lipo is, the wires end up taking up a relatively large portion of the room in your bag. Plus its ugly and confusing as heck with all those wires. You're more likely to get a bad connection or screw up wiring it. Look at Kang's awesome scooter with the 6s packs. Even with those its a hair ball. I can't imagine a big pack made of all 2s, it would be a nightmare!

 

[Karl]

Ok I will go with 6s packs. Its will make it easier to charge then spending the afternoon charging the 16packs.

Will the Dean Connectors be enough to draw that many amps?

 

[Ykick]

I was confused with people mentioning 3.2-3.7V parameters - those aren't Lipo numbers I'm used to dealing with. For my 15S packs I rarely use the RC charger anymore - they just don't get enough out of balance to bother with a balance charge. Meanwell power supply is the convenient way to go for bulk charging.

Several people around here use Deans connectors and from what I see I like 'em. I don't think you'll have any trouble pulling 20-30A through 'em. I personally use Andersons but they do require a learning curve for initial assembly and maintaining proper connection in a system.

all the best to you!

 

[dogman dan]

I'm not familar with Deans enough to say. I'm right at the limit, with my andersons. I run a 40 amp controller max. Any bigger, and I need to upsize everything. Fortunately they don't seem to care if I run 2000 watts continuous through em, and have 3400 watt bursts of a few seconds. 45 amp andersons housings and 45 amp contacts.

So far, it's plenty of power for me. If I really want much more than that, regular motorcycles start to look good to me anyway. 46 mph bicycle is pretty thrilling, so for now I'm satisfied enough. BTW, none of this high power stuff is street ridden, except for sneaking out to test something just built. My street Ebikes are 1200 watts, 20-25 mph and street legal in my state. The high power stuff is race track, or off road.

 

[Karl]

Ok thanks guys my plan is taking shape now. What guage of wires do I need now? just the regular 10's?

 

[Karl]

I decided to change battery and layout

 

[Karl]

Is the cycle analyst really a must to begin with?

I am almost done with my build

I purchased
the batteries (74v10ah)
the foam case
lyen's 18 fet controller
the backpack
the bike
the slick 2.5 tires
new front brake pads

only missing
HS3540 motor
split twist throttle
cycle analyst (wondering if its really needed to begin with)

Thanks

 

[skeetab5780]

Just to give you a heads up i was going to purchase those 10 cell lipos also till i read some reviews on them. They are just 2 X 5 cells lipo packs just heat shrinked together, so you end up with the same ammount of leads/wires if you bought 2 X 5cell packs instead good luck with your ebike!

 

[MadRhino]

Is the cycle analyst really a must to begin with?

You could do with a watt meter, but the CA gives so much usefull info that you will buy it anyway sooner or later, and end up saying:
Why did I wait so long to get this!

 

[Karl]

Is the cycle analyst really a must to begin with?

You could do with a watt meter, but the CA gives so much usefull info that you will buy it anyway sooner or later, and end up saying:
Why did I wait so long to get this!

alright you got me

Rhino, is the new CA removable? like a regular bike speedometer? I just dont want someone to steal my CA while im enjoying a meal in a restorant

 

[Karl]

Just to give you a heads up i was going to purchase those 10 cell lipos also till i read some reviews on them. They are just 2 X 5 cells lipo packs just heat shrinked together, so you end up with the same ammount of leads/wires if you bought 2 X 5cell packs instead good luck with your ebike!

Ya, I made the poors and cons of that idea and still ended up with 10s packs.

GOODSIDE

10s nanotech has 2 balancing wires 5s + 5s and only 2 main power wires
Meanig less wires hanging around in my back pack.
Instead of charging 8 packs 1 by 1 I am dropping to 4 packs to charge 1 by 1 while I wait for more fund for more hobby chargers

DOWNSIDE

10s is that I am converting my hedge trimmer to brushless electric and I will just blowup any of my small brushless motors with 37v
and I am affraid that since a human back is not reall flat & straight im scared of bending the battery slowly...