LIfepo4 36v 15ah 4 years later 10 mile range.

[Blueshift]

My Ping battery is dying on me. Well it has slowly been dying. I cant take the battery apart or put the meter leads on the bms because i have a visual impairment and chances are that I would shock myself or cause more damage to the battery.

The Only thing I could do would be to check the voltage of the charger as the pins are bigger and only 3 of them. it is a 1a charge the default one that came with the battery. it has 3 prongs. Where do i put the leads from the voltmeter onto the charger.... the end has 3 prongs... kinda like an xlr cable for a microphone. One of the pins is lined up with the top part that snaps in to secure connection with the other end.

O
O O

A little bit about my battery use. I have ran it dry 3 times altogether over the 4 years Ive had it. I usually leave 20-40 percent charge in the battery. By ran it dry I mean where it shuts off. I suppose the BMS could shut it all off if one of the cells was dangerously low?

Anyways, my only option is to hope its a bad charger at this point. I guess it might be to late, but its worth a shot i guess.

 

[amberwolf]

As noted above, it is most likely a cell (or few) that no longer have full capacity.

But it could just be some are lower than others, and if they are only unbalanced, it might be fixable with just the charger.

It takes a long time, but if you want to try it, you can just leave the battery on the charger for several days (or more), or just leave it on there whenever you are not using it. This will give it time to balance the cells, which if they're really out of balance can take quite a long time.

 

[eva-michael]

When the battery pack cut off. Check voltage of all cell. Mark voltage of each cell
1__, 2,__, 3__, 4__, 5__, 6__, 7__, 8__, 9__, 10__, 11__, 12__
In your case, healthy cells should be still around 2.9-3.2V when battery pack cut off. Find out cell which voltage drop serously.
Charge battery pack by your battery pack charger. And then try to charge the cell which voltage drop serously when discharge cut off by a lifepo4 single cell charger. Just try to make up power for this low energy cell.
See if the pack can get back the energy he should have. If no, that cell(cells) which voltage drop serously is(are) probably dying. Need to be replaced.

Regarding replacing, it will be better you can estimate cycle life situation of other healthy cells according to your application and If they look bulging.

 

[Peter.bp]

Connect battrey to charger for at least 24 hours and (while battery is on the charger) then measure cell voltages...

FYI, my 16S LiFePO4 10Ah battery is now 10 years old and still has over 80% of original capacity.
Usually on beginning of every season I leave battery on the charger for one week, think that after 10 years is time to open the battery and to check cell voltages... :lol:

 

[amberwolf]

I'm not sure if the last two people replying have actually fully read the OP of this thread, but it's already been stated he can't see to take it apart or do testing of voltages at the cell level, due to risk of shorts.

I cant take the battery apart or put the meter leads on the bms because i have a visual impairment and chances are that I would shock myself or cause more damage to the battery. .

 

[dogman dan]

In any case, about 4 years is the ping lifespan anyway. Even if it was used very carefully.

Time to reinvest. Meanwhile, try to force a balance on it by charging fully, leaving on the charger an hour, then ride around the block. repeat about 5 times. This will do the same thing as leaving on the charger for a day or two.

If that doesn't help, it's just that some of your cells are dying. Order now, and limp around till it comes. Sea ship nowdays, so it will be fall.

 

[Blueshift]

Okay, Ive got a reading from the power supply it says 42volts. the sticker on the power supply i believe it says 46v. Is that bad?

Was i supposed to take the amp reading as well?

 

[999zip999]

How many blinky led's light up ? A ping usually comes with a singalab BMS with 12 Blinky lights for 36 volt do all your lights light up. I sean singlelab and charger set to charge 3.8v at this point the bms bleeds cells down to 3.6v.
But I don't use a bms as I have 20ah cell. Big and heavy. But one large cell is very ez to monitor . You have three 5ah cells in parallel for 15ah. If one of three is weak it brings down the whole pack. 15 ah ping has 36 cells for 15ah 3 in parallel.

 

[Blueshift]

How many blinky led's light up ? A ping usually comes with a singalab BMS with 12 Blinky lights for 36 volt do all your lights light up.

Usually I have about 4 that don't light up.

I have to catch the others at the right time it seems to see them stay solid.
An overnight charge will show none on usually.

After last nights charge I was getting only one blinking light the rest were off.

 

[Peter.bp]

Okay, Ive got a reading from the power supply it says 42volts. the sticker on the power supply i believe it says 46v. Is that bad?

Was i supposed to take the amp reading as well?

I suspect that BMS doesn't activate balance because of too low cell voltage...
In other words: yes, it is bad if your charger limits voltage to 42V.

As I understand, you have twelve leds indicating when particular cell (group) is full?
If so, try to add variable voltage power source (0-5V) in series with with your charger in order to increase the battery voltage and keep charging until all leds are on.
If you have only one cell flat, it can take ages until you can charge it full. The problem is very low bleeding current inside BMS (often it is less than 200mA)...

When your battery reach 45V, measure charging current into it, it will indicate how much bleeding current is for balancing cells.

 

[999zip999]

Do you have a voltmeter or multimeter. We need the real voltage of your charger and battery.

 

[Blueshift]

Do you have a voltmeter or multimeter. We need the real voltage of your charger and battery.

Real voltage of the charger? I used a multimeter and checked the ends without it plugged into the battery. It read 42.1 volts As for the battery, its too small for me to see the terminals on the bms without risking shorting something out.

 

[teklektik]

I believe the Signalab BMS doesn't light a LED until it gets to about 3.65V. The charger typically charges to a slightly higher voltage and the BMS bleeds charge until the cell voltage drops to a bit under 3.65V at which time the LED goes dark.

Based on your report that 4 cells never light, and the charger is only 42V, it seems you have 4 cells that are being severely undercharged.

Looking at this from the perspective of per-cell voltage:

• You have 12 cells (well actually 12 sets of 3 cells in parallel (3 x 5Ah = 15Ah))
• 8 cells light up so they must be at least at 3.65V or 8 x 3.65V = 29.2V
• Your charger puts out only 42V, so this leaves 42V - 29.2V = 12.8V for the other 4 no-LED cells
• Assuming equal voltage on those 4 no-LED cells, they are charged only to 12.8V/4 = 3.2V
• 3.2V/cell is very underchanged... (something like 20%)

You need a new charger.

• No amount of time on that charger is ever going to balance those undercharged cells because they can't see a charge voltage of more than 3.2V or so...

With a new charger in hand, you can either have someone help you by manually bleeding down the 8 full-charged cells with a resistor or light bulb, or leave your battery on the charger until the charger stops cycling on and off (close to a week).

• If your low cells are at about 20% charge as the numbers suggest, then they will need 15Ah x 80% = 12Ah of charge to reach 100%. To get that into the low cells, the BMS will need to bleed that much off the other cells. Assuming a 100ma bleed rate we get 12000mAh / 100ma = 120 hours. So no less than about 5 days and probably longer (the balancing current may not be 100ma...).

 

[999zip999]

Charger should read 44.3 volts. Or close. 42 volts is to low to trip the bms to fully balance. A battery is only as good as it weakest cell.

 

[Blueshift]

Should I get another charger from Ping? Or is there another option?

 

[teklektik]

There's a good chance that the charger can be adjusted back up to the target voltage. That's not unusual at all but I'm unfamiliar with the Ping chargers. Problems at your end are the skills and eyesight.

You need a charger with the same connector. Any 12S LiFePo4 charger of about 5A or less will work, but changing the connector over sort gets into the skills and eyesight thing again.

That sort of sets you up for a replacement from Ping. Their 5A 12S charger is $59, which seems a good way to go and you get the proper connector ready to plug and play. They sell the same charger for $44 as an add-on to their 36V 15Ah battery - you might email them with your problem and ask if they might give you a bit of a discount on a replacement for your old dying Ping charger (just a thought - can't hurt...).

In any case $59 to get this on the road again after 4 years seems pretty modest...

 

[999zip999]

The back plastic 2 amp charger is not adjustable the 5 Amp ping charger can be adjusted within its limits. I have an old 48v Ping charger. I adjusted to 72 v it had 63v caps, I replaced with 100v caps still works at 82volts 10 times ? Love those Ping charges 5a metal. Li Ping is my uncle.

 

[teklektik]

Li Ping is my uncle.

Really?? That is so cool!
He's practically ebike battery royalty

 

[Blueshift]

Also I notice a smell from the batteries. Its not a burnt smell I don't think. It smell plastic. I don't know if I would call it a sweet smell. Are you supposed to remove the plastic wrap from the BMS? I just left it on all these years.

I notice the smell when I open my ammo can. (My battery is in an ammo can on the bike.)

Should I worry about off-gasing? Or might it be plastic being trapped inside the ammo can . There is a hole at the bottom of the can. (half inch in diameter)

 

[999zip999]

The Ping battery has a sweet-smelling electrolytes in it this would only come from punctured cell it's a very sweet chemical smell.
It's very hard to check cell voltage thru the wire harness or bms, ez to short.
If you have a smell and low voltage unbalanced cells you may need to cut the top of the battery open. The top with all tab connections so you can get the per cell voltage. Write down on paper, a very important step like these.
1. 3.34v
2. 3.38
3. 3.65


12. Xxx volts
Do a visual inspection to see if the cells are bloated and are leaking you just need to cut the edges of the pack very lightly do not stick a metal object in the pack.
Blueshift I'm in California too big state, where are you at ?

 

[e-beach]

Do you have a friend who can help you open your pack and test the cells on an individual per cell level? If not, perhaps it is a good time to make a new friend. 8)

+1 on the need for a new charger. My 36v LiFePO chargers are usually set to 43.8v so the cells will get 3.65v per cell. As stated above the BMS won't balance until it hits a trigger voltage somewhere around 43.8v. A generic 44v charger will work, if the connector is proper.

+1 on a new battery. You can probably get this one up and going for a while longer with a new charger, but it is in it's end of life trajectory now.

 

[Blueshift]

The Ping battery has a sweet-smelling electrolytes in it this would only come from punctured cell it's a very sweet
Blueshift I'm in California too big state, where are you at ?

I'm in the Hesperia/Victorville area. We call it the high desert. Its that place when your heading from LA to Vegas that turns into the desert after the Cajon Pass. Not to great in the way of eating and shopping, but plenty of dirt trails

 

[dogman dan]

The sweet smell is the pouches that swelled up and leaked, or just leaked from mechanical abrasion.

Your pack is pretty much done bro.

 

[Blueshift]

Is it safe to use till I get another battery?

How long does it take to off-gas completely?

I think its always had a smell though since i first got it.

Is it possible for something to off-gas for 4 years?

 

[Blueshift]

Update: I bought a 5a 36v charger.

I now have 11 solid leds and one that is lighting up, but i have only had the new charger on for a few minutes. I will update and see if the final led goes solid.