Floont
1 kW
Thanks, man.Ypedal said:oy..
Sorry to hear the terrible news.. ...
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Thanks, man.Ypedal said:oy..
Sorry to hear the terrible news.. ...
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I'm really really glad the cat did not die in the fire! (though my house fire a few months ago was not ebike-related, I lost all my dogs to it, so I could guess how you feel about things now).Floont said:PS My cat just got out of the animal hospital with tongue and throat burns and injuries due to smoke inhalation. This hobby is not just worth it.
amberwolf said:I'm really really glad the cat did not die in the fire!Floont said:PS My cat just got out of the animal hospital with tongue and throat burns and injuries due to smoke inhalation. This hobby is not just worth it.
My wife heard a crackling sound in the garage and checked and saw the fire in the garage. There are no smoke detectors in the garage.bowlofsalad said:What a bummer, sorry for your loss.
Sadly, a lot of people shy away from controversy and refrain from asking serious and important questions about events that have transpired surrounding devastation such as yours.
I have some questions for you though, concerning the occurrence of your fire, it would be of benefit to myself and others if you could answer these questions honestly.
Could you explain the series of events leading up to the fire? Things I am looking for are bike crashes, plugging in a charger, cell checking involving something like a multimeter or a celllog. Anything and everything may be of use.
Where were you when you realized things were on fire?
I tried to get over to it with a fire extinguisher, but the smoke and heat were too much. I ran outside with the fire extinguisher thinking that I could break a window and battle it from out side. But the fire had grown too big for that action. It was beyond a home fire extinguisher and professionals needed to be called, which we immediately did.What did you do when you realized something was on fire?
No we have one single CO detector and smoke detector in the center of the house. There was no detection in the garage... a big mistake may a say.Did you have any sort of linked fire alarm system through out your home? Linked fire alarms mean if any single fire alarm detects a fire in one place, all connected fire alarms sound.
Yes, but I couldn't get to it quick enough. The fire spread so quickly.Did you have a filled and tested fire extinguisher somewhere in the close vicinity of where you'd park and charge your ebike?
YESDo you think your disaster might have been avoided had you been using a different chemistry other than lipo?
It was an Alloy shell charger from BMSbattery.Who did you buy your charger from? I am specifically curious about how you know that the charger was the exact cause of the fire, my guess would be that was what the fire department thinks, but maybe you saw it light on fire and start burning other things.
Don't use LIpo and if you must balance them frequently. Avoid buying anything form BMSbatteryWhat advice would you give to others beyond being aware of the dangers of cheap chargers and lipo for those who currently use ebikes and those looking to get into ebikes?
No offense taken. I don't want anyone to go through what I just went through.I suppose those are some of the more important questions I might have. Please, do not take offense to these questions. I ask these questions from an educational perspective so that everyone including myself might learn from histories mistakes.
I hope things are getting better for you, floont.
No, I hope that the consensus is that there are safer battery chemistries for our application than LiPo - LiFePO4 for instance. The very slight drawback of a bit more heavy, less energy dense, is a very small price to pay for never having to risk a fire. Floont, thanks for posting your experience and wishing you the very best for your recovery in life!el_walto said:I hope members here have finally reached the consensus to never bulk charge lipo without a cell level HVC.
Floont said:Upgraded from 30s2p to 35s2p Turnigy Lipo yesterday. Now I'm running it at about 146VDC maximum. Speed and torque increased, of course.
FA
Damn, I wish I had written that rant. Pure win.Chalo said:There is a certain perverse beauty in the Roadmaster Mt. Fury, because it's an utterly pure expression of Bicycle-Shaped Objectivity. ...
cwah said:did you charge without bms?
gwhy! said:Floont, hope you get your life back on track in the shortest possible time and without much hassle. All the best and thanks for sharing.
friendly1uk said:cwah said:did you charge without bms?
The common denominator in every fire here is not lipo, it is having no bms.
Think about how much money we save not using one. I reckon that is about nothing. Now weigh that es wide saving against the es wide cost of not using one. Its a few houses, vehicles, outbuildings and lots of smoke damage. The currant trend leads towards someones life but so far it's just pets.
It's not even worth talking about. Where are the proper battery packs in these fire threads. What sort of dick spends 10% of his waking hours nursing batteries to save a few hours wages. What kind of dick would listen to these people instead of professionals. With dicks of this magnitude about, do these fires come as any surprise?
I wonder where the OP got the idea that it would be ok? who actually burnt the house down (if that is to be believed)
pdf said:friendly1uk said:cwah said:And I don't think being careless makes you a dick. It makes you a human. There are any number of people on this web site advocating pro/con LiPO, pro/coon bulk charging, pro/con BMS. Many of them with years of experience who will be quick to point that out. So how do you figure out in this small universe who is the professional?
LiPo evolved in the RC culture of the highest power density per weight possible, because that's what their application demanded. Then some ebikers, perhaps on this very forum, had what they probably thought was a brilliant idea, of packing them up into larger packs to move their contraption around on the roads. Then a cult following emerged, again, promoted here and elsewhere, by an industry that saw its business expanding.pdf said:I will have to beg to differ. From a scientific point of view, it is, as far as I know, always LiPO. There have been fires reported with resting LiPO right on this board. In which case, the presence or absence of a BMS is irrelevant..... I think one poster said it best; LiFePO4 is diesel, LiPO is nitromethane. Use with appropriate caution or leave it alone.
arkmundi said:LiPo evolved in the RC culture of the highest power density per weight possible, because that's what their application demanded. Then some ebikers, perhaps on this very forum, had what they probably thought was a brilliant idea, of packing them up into larger packs to move their contraption around on the roads. Then a cult following emerged, again, promoted here and elsewhere, by an industry that saw its business expanding.pdf said:I will have to beg to differ. From a scientific point of view, it is, as far as I know, always LiPO. There have been fires reported with resting LiPO right on this board. In which case, the presence or absence of a BMS is irrelevant..... I think one poster said it best; LiFePO4 is diesel, LiPO is nitromethane. Use with appropriate caution or leave it alone.
But all the while, automotive grade lithium-ion battery R&D continued at a rapid pace and we have other lithium-ion chemistries available for our use, safer and more appropriate to the application.
I had hoped that Floont's precautionary tale might provide one of those moments for a new consensus on this invaluable forum to simply say NO MORE LIPO, because of the fire risks involved and that it is UNNECESSARY. The audience here is not just the experienced, but the inexperienced as well, hoping for sage advice in their builds, whether for sport & recreation, or as a transportation alternative. It is for their benefit. Please choose one the many available LiFePO4 (or similar) batteries available, designed for and tested for the automotive industry, where safety matters, a lot.
gwhy! said:As I said before its irrelevant what chemistry you have it can all start a fire.. I have had NiCads explode and burst into flames whilst charging ( and know many people that is has also happened to , this was with fast chargers in the field so no real damage done) , and these were 1.2v 1ah C cells ( and yes it was a long time ago ) , I have also dealt with standby battery/chargers failures in electronic equipment that on very,very rare occasions have caused fires in my place of work . Lipo when they go, will be a lot more devastating due to the size, power density and the performance of them. There have been reports of lifepo4 cells exploding for no apparent reason you only need to surf the web a little to find that all sorts of chemistries can burst into flames ( but 99% of the time there will be a underlying problem that have caused it ) and battery fires are not always related to the e-bike crowd. Just look and see what will happen if you put a spanner across the terminals of a 12v 40ah lead acid battery and put some flammable material near by, it will start a very nice big fire in no time ...