Sunwin controller throttle delay lag [SOLVED]

Bikebrap

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Joined
Oct 7, 2015
Messages
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Ok so I had a Sunwin 72V 1500W controller for a year now on my e-bike. It took me a long time to get a hang on why and how delay occurs.

For all you that don't know a lot of sunwin controllers have lag built in. Mine has a terrible one. I think it's the more powerfull ones that have it. It's a 1 second delay and it gets wores with higher speeds. Basicaly a throttle has a sort of a filter bulit in controller, my guess for safety reasons. Filter allows mximum throttle rump up speead, which is ok, and cheap sloution, when you give it a full throttle to have a decent aceleration. The thing is if you go for example 50kmh, let go of the throttle and twist it again, the throttle resests to 0 and has to rump up the voltage slowly to your speed to get a torque buliding up (DC motors basic understanding required). Only when applied voltage gets higher than corresponding motor speed torque occurs.

Solution:
I intercepted a throttle signal with arduino, and if throttle is let go and the wheel is spinning, an arduino sends an analog signal value that makes controller make a voltage on a motor that coresponds to it's rotational speed minus 5kmh slower. That way a signal on controler is always a bit lower than the speed of motor and never resetting no 0, only when you stop, and it's anticipating / waiting for throttle twist. A rump up filter is still there it's just that it has a much smaller voltage gap to rump up so it rumps up much quicker.

There is also a delay on a take off and it is solwed by setting a lowest signal voltage a bit higher than it is on standard throttle, also with arduino.

It's a bit complicated so if furrther explaining is needed, just say :)

p.s. Also If someone is using a Sunwin, please post if it has a delay and what model it is

Tags: bike bicycle electric ebike controler delay lag throttle
 
Just for reference.

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/search.php?keywords=throttle+resistor&t=71128&sf=msgonly

Re: $14.99 72v Sunwin Controller
Just switched my 60v500w Sunwin controller (with shunt mod) for a new Sunwin 60v 1500w controller (also with shunt mod) and got a little disappointed: the throttle lag is terrible.
It takes a few seconds before the full power is available after I completely turn open throttle, like a smooth fade in.
My old 500w sunwin controller didn't have this much lag at all.

After a little measuring and comparing on both controllers I think I found the component responsible for the lag.

It's a capacitor on the spot marked :E10
This capacitor is not seen on my old 500w board and also not seen in most of the early pictures in this Topic.
Throttle signal 0-4.2V goes through resistor R54 through the capacitor E10 +side to the microchip.
- side of the capacitor connects to ground.

So what I think the capacitor does is charge if you open the throttle.
Because the capacitor is charging the throttle signal towards the chip can't change from 0v to 4.2v in no time, it takes about 2 seconds before it is charged to 4,2 volts

EDIT:
The capacitor on E10 is indeed for smoothing out throttle, but it only slows down the throttle voltage climbing a tiny bit, I did notice the difference but it was not the result I hoped for.

However after I replaced the 2 big 80v 470uF capacitors near the fets for 2 new 100V 470uF caps throttle response is much better! The 2 biggest caps in the controller are already rated 100v so I leave them standaard.

I use a 20s lipo charged to 80 Volts, so I thought 80v caps would work fine, but it turns out my 80v caps don't charge to 80v, the 100v rated capacitors I used does charge to 80v.
Now my throttle response is a lot better.
by denbesenjoel
Sat May 07, 2016 9:12 am

Forum: E-Bike Technical
Topic: $14.99 72v Sunwin Controller
Replies: 352
Views: 14086
 
I bought one of these a while back and never got around to cracking it open. Subscribing to this thread so that I remember to do this mod when thicken the traces, add a CAV3 harness, increase the size of the shunt, install a temp sensor, etc.
 
stevc said:
Just for reference.

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/search.php?keywords=throttle+resistor&t=71128&sf=msgonly

Re: $14.99 72v Sunwin Controller
Just switched my 60v500w Sunwin controller (with shunt mod) for a new Sunwin 60v 1500w controller (also with shunt mod) and got a little disappointed: the throttle lag is terrible.
It takes a few seconds before the full power is available after I completely turn open throttle, like a smooth fade in.
My old 500w sunwin controller didn't have this much lag at all.

After a little measuring and comparing on both controllers I think I found the component responsible for the lag.

It's a capacitor on the spot marked :E10
This capacitor is not seen on my old 500w board and also not seen in most of the early pictures in this Topic.
Throttle signal 0-4.2V goes through resistor R54 through the capacitor E10 +side to the microchip.
- side of the capacitor connects to ground.

So what I think the capacitor does is charge if you open the throttle.
Because the capacitor is charging the throttle signal towards the chip can't change from 0v to 4.2v in no time, it takes about 2 seconds before it is charged to 4,2 volts

EDIT:
The capacitor on E10 is indeed for smoothing out throttle, but it only slows down the throttle voltage climbing a tiny bit, I did notice the difference but it was not the result I hoped for.

However after I replaced the 2 big 80v 470uF capacitors near the fets for 2 new 100V 470uF caps throttle response is much better! The 2 biggest caps in the controller are already rated 100v so I leave them standaard.

I use a 20s lipo charged to 80 Volts, so I thought 80v caps would work fine, but it turns out my 80v caps don't charge to 80v, the 100v rated capacitors I used does charge to 80v.
Now my throttle response is a lot better.
by denbesenjoel
Sat May 07, 2016 9:12 am

Forum: E-Bike Technical
Topic: $14.99 72v Sunwin Controller
Replies: 352
Views: 14086

I saw that post,and tried it my self while ago. Bought the 100V caps, oppened my controller and what do I find. It already has 100V caps on that place. But as I had a new ones I changed them anyway. Result was: no change in delay :/
 
Bikebrap said:
Ok so I had a Sunwin 72V 1500W controller for a year now on my e-bike. It took me a long time to get a hang on why and how delay occurs.

For all you that don't know a lot of sunwin controllers have lag built in. Mine has a terrible one. I think it's the more powerfull ones that have it. It's a 1 second delay and it gets wores with higher speeds. Basicaly a throttle has a sort of a filter bulit in controller, my guess for safety reasons. Filter allows mximum throttle rump up speead, which is ok, and cheap sloution, when you give it a full throttle to have a decent aceleration. The thing is if you go for example 50kmh, let go of the throttle and twist it again, the throttle resests to 0 and has to rump up the voltage slowly to your speed to get a torque buliding up (DC motors basic understanding required). Only when applied voltage gets higher than corresponding motor speed torque occurs.

Solution:
I intercepted a throttle signal with arduino, and if throttle is let go and the wheel is spinning, an arduino sends an analog signal value that makes controller make a voltage on a motor that coresponds to it's rotational speed minus 5kmh slower. That way a signal on controler is always a bit lower than the speed of motor and never resetting no 0, only when you stop, and it's anticipating / waiting for throttle twist. A rump up filter is still there it's just that it has a much smaller voltage gap to rump up so it rumps up much quicker.

There is also a delay on a take off and it is solwed by setting a lowest signal voltage a bit higher than it is on standard throttle, also with arduino.

It's a bit complicated so if furrther explaining is needed, just say :)

p.s. Also If someone is using a Sunwin, please post if it has a delay and what model it is

Tags: bike bicycle electric ebike controler delay lag throttle

I was considering this controller but after hearing about the lag I'm changing my mind I think. Did you ever figure out how to completely get rid of the lag?
 
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