Will KT controller work with scooter.

[ScooterBill]

Thanks in advance to anyone that can help me.

Should have probably asked for help before I purchased a new controller.

I have a 3 wheel mobility type scooter with a 750 watt 48 volt direct drive brushless motor (front wheel). It had a generic controller with reverse and no display. Link to old controller https://www.amazon.ca/Motor-Brushle...sor+controller+for+e-bike,sporting,174&sr=1-3

I wanted to upgrade to a better controller with a display so I bought a new KT36/48SVPRK-SLS02G controller with a KT-LCD8H display. Link to new controller https://www.amazon.ca/Brushless-Con...ontroller+regenerative+braking,aps,142&sr=8-1

I hope I put the links in correctly.

Anyway, I have not been able to get this new controller to work. I have hooked up only the basic connections needed. Power, throttle, motor wires, 6-wire phase connector (no signal wire, white wire), electric lock - jumpered, with and without the display (display plug bypassed without the display) and get nothing. Motor doesn't spin or even try to start, when using the display the display does turn on, won't work in walk-mode from the display (should this bypass the throttle).

Everything will work with the old controller, so motor and throttle are fine. I have gone over all connections multiple times, verifying proper wiring, polarity, etc. I have the wiring diagrams for both controllers and have communicated with the seller of the new controller without results.

I thought I did my homework, checking what would work with my scooter but am now having doubts. Can any one tell me if this new controller will replace the old one. I knew I would have some work to do changing connectors and setup stuff but thought it would at least show me it would work. I have either a faulty controller or I have an incompatible controller, can anyone help me rule out that I haven't just purchased the wrong controller. Seller thought it should work.

I believe I have a fairly good understanding of my scooter and how it should work and should be somewhat knowledgeable about wiring, schematics, etc. as I was an Electronics Technician (medical field) in my younger years.

Thank again.

 

[amberwolf]

Anyway, I have not been able to get this new controller to work. I have hooked up only the basic connections needed. Power, throttle, motor wires, 6-wire phase connector (no signal wire, white wire), electric lock - jumpered, with and without the display (display plug bypassed without the display) and get nothing. Motor doesn't spin or even try to start, when using the display the display does turn on, won't work in walk-mode from the display (should this bypass the throttle).

A few things to check:

Do you get 5v at the throttle connector's 5v wire (usually red), relative to ground (usually black, but you can use the battery negative wire as ground for reference to anywhere in the system)?

If not, then do you get battery voltage on at least two of the wires on the controller side of the display/controller connector, when it is connected to the display and the display is turned on and working?

Alternately, if using the "electric lock"; this is usually a wire that passes battery voltage back to the controller's internal LVPS (that converts battery to 15/12/5v/etc.). If the controller doesn't get battery voltage to the input of hte LVPS you won't get 5v at the throttle (or anywhere else, including the MCU) and the system won't run.

The display itself often has a function that does the same thing internally (passes battery voltage back to the controller's LVPS) when it's turned on, and cuts that off when the display is turned off.


Also, just to verify: you say a 6-wire phase connector; usually that's only three thick wires. The 6-wire is usually thinner wires for the hall sensors and either a speedometer or thermal sensor on the white wire (if it uses that wire at all). Is that what you meant?

 

[ScooterBill]

Thanks for your quick reply.

With the display connected and turned on (display lit up), I do get voltage 5v at the electric lock and it is jumpered, so 5v on both sides.

I do not get 5v between the red and black or negative at the throttle with the new controller. I do get 5v on the old controller which is expected as it works, just double checking to verify I am doing thing right.

So from this it looks like, with no voltage at the throttle the controller is defective. So am I incorrect in thinking that the walk mode would make the motor spin without the throttle working?

Otherwise do you think the KT controller should work with my scooter, just want to make sure before I order a replacement.

And yes, my mistake in saying phase wire should have said hall wires.

 

[amberwolf]

With the display connected and turned on (display lit up), I do get voltage 5v at the electric lock and it is jumpered, so 5v on both sides.

"electric lock" (EL) (when referring to keyswitch / ignition / "door lock" / etc, at least) is not usually a 5v signal, so this is different enough from most controllers I have experience with that we'll leave that for later in the post, and work on the other stuff first:

I do not get 5v between the red and black or negative at the throttle with the new controller. I do get 5v on the old controller which is expected as it works, just double checking to verify I am doing thing right.

So from this it looks like, with no voltage at the throttle the controller is defective. So am I incorrect in thinking that the walk mode would make the motor spin without the throttle working?

If you have no 5v at the throttle, but do have it elsewhere on the controller wiring (halls, etc), then there is something wrong either with wiring (probaby inside the controller) or with where things are being measured, or even possibly with the connector labelling (i.e., it isn't actually the throttle connector and isn't one that has 5v available).

If there is anywhere in the controller, then the controller is being turned on (battery voltage is getting to the LVPS inside).

The walk mode should make the controller operate, assuming the controller itself supports it (sometimes a display has a function the controller doesn't support, and vice-versa) but:

Do you get 5v at the hall connector? (similar to throttle, it should have about 5v from red to black, and with the motor not plugged into it should also have about 5v on each of the green/blue/yellow wires as well).

If there's no 5v there, either, there's some problem preventing the controller from generating 5v (defective controller or wiring problem), or some other fault that is keeping it from showing up where it should.

If you have throttle and motor and everything but display and battery unplugged, with display off what do you read on any of the 5v wires? Then same with display on? What changes when you unplug the EL loop? (including what voltages you read on each pin of the EL connector without the loop)

Regarding the EL function:

The diagram from the amazon page for the KT controller shows:
https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71tBX1+XbvL._AC_SL1101_.jpg

whcih does not specify what the electric lock is supposed to connect to, or if it is a connector you jumper across, or even what function it represents. It may be a form of system disable connector, in which case jumpering across it disables the controller. (if it's an *enable* connnector, jumpering would enable the controller).

A quick search didn't find a definitive answer to it's function, and the sale page doesn't have any further info than that diagram.

 

[ScooterBill]

First off, sorry for my error. The voltage at the electric lock jumper is 50v, battery voltage, not 5v as I put in my post.

So with talking with the seller, it has been decided that the controller is defective and I will return the controller, but I still need to purchase a new one.

From my understanding so far from the great advice I have gotten here, is that this type of controller should work with by scooter. Just want to make sure before I get the same one, or are there other recommendations. I would like it to work with a KT display, have reverse.

 

[amberwolf]

From my understanding so far from the great advice I have gotten here, is that this type of controller should work with by scooter. Just want to make sure before I get the same one, or are there other recommendations. I would like it to work with a KT display, have reverse.

Get the display and controller at the same time in the same kit if you want to be certain that they will work together. Otherwise, if purchased separately, firmware or hardware differences might make them not work as expected or at all. A KT controller *should* work with a KT display, but still safer to buy them together if the opportunity exists.


Generally all the brushless motors and controllers can work together, with certain rare exceptions.

As long as your motor has hall sensors (that work), then "any" brushless controller should work with it; if the sensors dont' work or it doesn't have any, you'd need a "sensorless" version.

The KT series generally should work either way. Different versions may have different feature sets, so make sure the one you are buying has the complete feature set you want out of it.


If it comes down to it and you can't get the right feature set, there are also opensource firmware replacements you can get for the KT series (a number of threads about it here on the forum, OSFW, OSF, OS FW, etc), though that would be added complexity to the setup and install, and probably have to buy a programming cable specific to the OSFW / controller setup.