18fet only drawing ~42a? What am I doing wrong?

[markw]

Hello ES,

Just got some new toys from Lyen! With new toys, new questions. CA is reporting that my 18fet is only drawing around 42a from my 20s2p RC LiPo battery. I've programmed my throttle correctly, indicator shows 99% throttle at WOT. I'm wondering what I'm doing wrong here. To help you help me, I'll provide some details.

Battery: 4x 5s Turnigy 20c LiPo, series with 12awg/4mm bullets. The two 5ah ps crimped, exit as 10awg. Connectors used for delivery are Anderson 45a PPs.
Controller: Lyen 18fet low RDS. Phase wire connectors used are 4mm bullets. Controller phase wires are 12 awg.
Motor: Phase wires are 13awg, bullet connectors. Motor is a MXUS 4t 3000w.

Battery draw from this controller should be 65a, do I have that correct?

Maybe there's something in the calibration setup that I have to adjust to have a read differently?

I can check the programming of the controller too if it helps, I'll have to set up the program.

I appreciate the help

 

[amberwolf]

Is the CA shunt setting correct for your shunt (the CA's shunt if it's an SA model, or the controller's shunt if it's a DP)? CA shunts are typically 1mohm. Controllers shunts vary, you'd want to check if it's marked on the label what it should be, and if not ask Lyen if he calibrated it and what it should be set to. (or look up how to measure it yourself if you prefer; there's a number of posts about that, and it may be in the wiki too).

If it is correct, then check that any 3-speed switch you have is set to whichever position is setup for full power/throttle.

If those are both correct, then perhaps the controller is not programmed correctly for it's current limit and/or throttle response. You'd want to ask Lyen about that first, if it's a new controller.

 

[markw]

Is the CA shunt setting correct for your shunt (the CA's shunt if it's an SA model, or the controller's shunt if it's a DP)? CA shunts are typically 1mohm. Controllers shunts vary, you'd want to check if it's marked on the label what it should be, and if not ask Lyen if he calibrated it and what it should be set to. (or look up how to measure it yourself if you prefer; there's a number of posts about that, and it may be in the wiki too).

If it is correct, then check that any 3-speed switch you have is set to whichever position is setup for full power/throttle.

If those are both correct, then perhaps the controller is not programmed correctly for it's current limit and/or throttle response. You'd want to ask Lyen about that first, if it's a new controller.

Hi Amber! Controller is labeled with 1.33 and CA is calibrated to 1.33 too, so that should be all in line! Thanks for putting 2+2 together for me though, I had wondered where I had seen that value before!

There is a 3 speed switch via CA but I've unplugged and disabled it with the same outcome

I'll check with Lyen, I could just set up and transfer over the 184110 profile - I don't need the 3 speed version since the CA controlling that with the throttle I assume. These values in the profile don't make any sense to me but I understand that they may not reflect real world values.

 

[999zip999]

Do you have a three speed switch ? Plug it in and try it. Nice to have any way.

 

[markw]

Do you have a three speed switch ? Plug it in and try it. Nice to have any way.

Hey 999zip999! I do have a 3 speed switch, but it's only been via CA and not through the controller itself. I've plugged it in, enabled, and tried the different positions without noting a higher draw of amps! :<

 

[999zip999]

I had an Lyen 12fet with low output I sent it back and Lyen reprogramed it I think. I also order the three speed switch at the same time, so was question as to what had fixed it. You have the program cable ? I wish you could see the old program before instaling the new one.

 

[cal3thousand]

Have you programmed the controller?

40A is what Lyen has them set at when you buy it.

 

[markw]

Have you programmed the controller?

40A is what Lyen has them set at when you buy it.

This ended up being the cause. I read read the listing as "65a is the current rate" and assumed it to be pre-programed. Rather, the line eludes more to the controller's capabilities. I've since programmed it with advice from both Lyen and teslanv, my motor supplier, and currently am still tweaking things. I have successfully pulled 67a from it, will probably dial it down to 60 as I play with the software more. Still searching for a guide which gives all the math for programming and break down of each setting.

Thanks for the input to all. I hit my first 5.3kW today. The ebike grin is still stuck on my face 8)

 

[markw]

For any of those experiencing the same position as I when they reach the thread:

Great thread on controller programming, dated a bit but still effectual: http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=14836

This is my profile for my MXUS 4t. I turned down the rated current from 55 to 50 and the phase current tweaked a bit too. I'm running 20s so the LVC should be accurate. Controller is from Lyen and does have the R12 mod so the Regen Voltage should be such that it can engage at any time even HOC.

Again, thanks for the help here!

 

[markz]

Hey markw, thanks for the info.
I too have Windows Vista, Lyen 18fet and 4T mxus.

I followed Lyens email that has the MarkII website for instructions,
Instruction #1. Download the driver here (Windows Vista & Windows 7 32bit/64bit), or here for (Windows XP driver only), and save it to a folder on your computer.

I click on Windows Vista & Windows 7 32bit/64bit
I click Save File
I have Firefox, it saves that file to "Down Arrow" on top right of screen, its the "Download Page".
USB-TTL_Adapter-Win7-Vista-Driver(5).zip - note: yes I have tried this on a couple different occasions, always getting same result. This time, this is try #5 indicated by (5).
Ok I click on that
Goes through a window called PL-2303 Vista Driver Installer and does its thing
Then says Install Wizard Finished - I click finish, which closes window

Instruction #2.Unzip and extract the zipped file to a local directory. (example: My Documents, Desktop, C:\temp, etc.)

I go to Download file sorted by date. I get - USB-TTL_Adapter_Win7-Vista_Driver(5).zip which I just.....I think....unzipped.
Im thinking its a driver right, so its not a program which will have a new shortcut on desktop.
I search for PL-2303 it finds nothing
I search for driver, I go through each Driver/driver folder, all I find are sys names.

I can't find anything.......

So I go to the thread you linked to
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=14836

I extract and run Kingfishes Infineon file, missing file, invalid not correctly in register. No Go.
Basically I cant open anything at the end of that post.

...........Which leaves me hanging..............
I will try some more then email Lyen.

 

[MadRhino]

Beef the traces, solder the shunt, upgrade wiring, bigger connectors... The 18 X 4110 Lyen's controller can pull enough power to kill your 20c lipo at the first ride.

 

[markz]

So Samsung 18650-25R's are ideal?

 

[MadRhino]

To feed all the power that you can mod a 18 X 4110 to pull, you need 40C RC lipo, or 2p of your 20C, or a f***** bunch of round cells. :wink:

 

[markz]

....so 5P of 25r, Good or Bad?

 

[MadRhino]

Close to be good, in theory. I have never tested them to know if they can feed 25C continuous. If they are, you would need 6p (and a very good assembly) to feed the 150A that all my 18 X 4110 controllers are pulling.

 

[markz]

Whooaaaa, 150A modded, WoW!
.....I like!!!!!!!!

 

[MadRhino]

Whooaaaa, 150A modded, WoW!
.....I like!!!!!!!!

Well, you might not like the investment. :wink:

I had to buy and mod and repair, at least 20 of them to finally have 3 that can survive this kind of power reliably. The good point is that they also survive a fair margin of extra voltage, for their 100v limit is exceeded everyday and sometimes up to 108v. Controllers are not born (and mod) equal. Some will fail repeatedly and have to be discarded, while the lucky number will survive extreme abuse over 30 000 Km of hard riding, -30 to +40, and a few crashes as a bonus.

 

[markz]

Well I dont want that, 20 seems crazy.
Just want to be able to download the program so I can change the settings on my 18fet 4110 65A Lyen.
I rebooted, cant find nothing.

My next step is to go to cnet, download an unzipper program and install it so I can just put everything onto a folder on my desktop.
I tried that before, no success, I will try it again. I have no other options that I know of, besides perhaps a CD-ROM being sent to me.

 

[markz]

OK The UnZip program from cnet, does the exact same thing.
I get the .zip file, unzip to get the .exe file.
Click on that.
Install Shield Wizard does its thing. Finishes.
I click on finish.
Same old same old, I'm getting no where.
It must install something, a program, a driver, something anything....then its a matter of where is it? I have no clue.

Like I say I check download folder which is where the .zip file goes, unpacks that to get to .exe, click on that goes to install shield wizard.

No Clue, none.
Looks like I paid $200 for a controller to do 40A. Just my luck these days, just my f'ing luck.

 

[MadRhino]

Beef the traces, solder the shunt, upgrade wiring, bigger connectors...

F*** the program
Solder the shunt, tricking it into thinking it is pulling 40A when it is pulling 150A
Beef the traces with copper mesh and silver solder, to make it able to route that much power without busting in flames
Upgrade wiring and connectors, you don't want them to melt

Stick your belly to the handlebar before twisting the throttle, unless you want the bike to fly alone

 

[Drunkskunk]

I had the same problem. I tried a vista machine, a Win7 box, and a win 8.1 box. All failed to work.
I finally fished out an old Win XP laptop from the back of the closet and loaded it up there. Worked first time with no issues.

Old used laptops are dirt cheap. I saw one in the pawn shop for $60.

 

[cal3thousand]

I had the same problem. I tried a vista machine, a Win7 box, and a win 8.1 box. All failed to work.
I finally fished out an old Win XP laptop from the back of the closet and loaded it up there. Worked first time with no issues.

Old used laptops are dirt cheap. I saw one in the pawn shop for $60.

I bet running XP on a VM would work too.

 

[markz]

cal3thousand makes good sense. Now, will this is anyway screw up my home computer, my only computer, which is used by 2 people for work?
I have heard of Virtual Machines, just never really looked into it.

 

[nutnspecial]

Hopefully the op doesn't mind- here's the print instruc that came with em3 18fet. I have win 7 64bit, and all I remember is messing around with administrator and compatibility mode a bit for the executable. After that came the issues of getting a usb /com free that was assignable in the program.

Don't know if you have any instructions with yours. Maybe this will help.

____________

1. Run the prolific driver file, Prolific_USB_Driver.exe
2. Install the em3ev.exe file. It is common to have an error when you try to then run the file due to missing .ocx files. However, recently the Prolific Driver has been changed and this seems to have solved many of the problems with errors. If you do not see any errors, do not make any changes.
3. For XP and Win7 32bit Firstly, you could try running the program in compatibility mode if there is the option to do so. Compatibility mode is found by right clicking on the EM3ev.exe program, select properties, then select “Compatibility”, then tick “Run this program in compatibility mode for”, select Windows XP, SP 2 or SP3. Try again to run the program again.
4. (if you experience any problems) you may need to copy the missing file/files (MSCOMM32.OCX, mscomctl.ocx, Comdlg32.ocx and/or RICHTX32.OCX) to: C:\windows\system32\
5. To register the files, you will need to use Command Prompt. Go to Start menu, you can either search for Command Prompt, or go to “Accessories” and you will see Command Prompt listed. Do not select it, instead right click and select “Run as Administrator” from the options. Copy and paste the following command to register MSCOMM32.OCX (if required):
regsvr32  %Systemroot%\System32\MSCOMM32.OCX
Remove any spaces from the end, before pressing the enter key. A message stating the file register succeeded, should be shown. Press OK.

Do the same for mscomctl.ocx (if required). Enter the following command:
regsvr32  %Systemroot%\System32\mscomctl.ocx
Remove any spaces from the end, before pressing the enter key. A message stating the file register succeeded, should be shown. Press OK.

Do the same for Comdlg32.ocx (if required). Enter the following command:
regsvr32  %Systemroot%\System32\Comdlg32.ocx
Remove any spaces from the end, before pressing the enter key. A message stating the file register succeeded, should be shown. Press OK.

Do the same for RICHTX32.OCX I (if required). Enter the following command:
regsvr32  %Systemroot%\System32\RICHTX32.OCX
Remove any spaces from the end, before pressing the enter key. A message stating the file register succeeded, should be shown. Press OK.

6. For Win7 64 Bit (if you experience any problems), initially try to run the program in XP mode, this can be done by right clicking on the program or shortcut to the program and selecting properties, then select “Compatibility”, then tick “Run this program in compatability mode for:”, select “Windows XP (service pack 3)”
7. If this does not work you can try to copy any files that are highlighted as a problem to folder C:\windows\SysWOW64\ (but Windows 7 can be quite difficult to do this).
8. To register the files you need open up a command prompt window as an administrator. Go to the start menu, and in the search field, enter cmd (don’t press enter) and then right click on the cmd.exe program icon in the menu, and choose 'run as administrator'. This can also be found in “All Program”, then open “Accessories”, you will see “Command Prompt”. Right click, and select “Run as Administrator”
9. That will now open a command prompt window as an admin. Paste the following commands into the window, 1 at a time (you should only need to add files and register them if you receive a message stating the file is missing or has a problem when the program is started):
C:\Windows\system32>regsvr32 c:\Windows\SysWOW64\comdlg32.ocx
then press enter.
paste in:
C:\Windows\system32>regsvr32 c:\Windows\SysWOW64\mscomm32.ocx
then press enter.
paste in:
C:\Windows\system32>regsvr32 c:\Windows\SysWOW64\richtx32.ocx
then press enter.
paste in:
C:\Windows\system32>regsvr32 c:\Windows\SysWOW64\mscomctl.ocx
then press enter.
10. Now run the EM3ev program.
11. Connect the Programming Cable to a USB port on your computer.
12. In order for the EM3ev Program to communicate with the programming cable, you must ensure the Prolific Com port has been assigned to a com port with a number between 1 and 5. Open Device Manager to check the assigned com port and change if necessary. Device Manager can be found by going through the following links from Control Panel, Control Panel/System/Hardware/Device Manager. When you select Device Manager, a new window will open, select Ports (Com & LPT). You should see Prolific USB to Serial Comm Port in the list and there will be a com port number alongside. Right click and select Properties. Select Port Settings, then Advanced. You will see a drop down box where you can select an alternative port number. In many cases, the port you want to select will already have “in use”, but have a look at the other devices assigned by going back to Device Manager and shuffle around the ports or just try a port and see if it works.
13. Now you have selected a port between 1 and 5 for the Prolific Device, you can go back to the EM3ev software and select the same port number. If you plug the program cable into a different USB port on your computer it may assign a different port number, so if the software shows a communication error, check the port number assigned in device manager as previously detailed.
14. Open the applicable .asv file for your model controller, a file for each of the models is included in the folder you downloaded. Select Open in the software and browse to the loacation the folder was saved to. Please note that when programming the 6 or 9 fet (EB306, EB309), unless otherwise advised, you should select EB312 in the Board Type drop down menu. When programming a 12 fet EB312, select EB312 from “Board Type” menu, but set the current levels to only 50% of the desired current level. Phase current should be set to between 2 and 2.5 * the “Rated” (battery) current. When programming the 18 fet, select EB318 and program to 50% of the desired current levels. Controllers fitted with IRFB4115 mosfets, intended for over 100V operation have the R12 mod to trick the controller that it is operating at only 50% of the actual voltage. So for any 4115 equipped controller, program all voltage levels to 50% of the desired value. When programming the EB324 model, select EB312 and program to only 25% of the desired current levels, the voltage settings are as per the EB318 settings mentioned previously
15. When programming the controller it should not be powered and all other parts should be disconnected.
16. Press “Start Transmit” in the EM3ev software, the button will then change to “Stop Transmit”, now press and hold the small push button on the programming lead. You should then see the transmit gauge scroll as the new program is installed onto the controller.

 

[markz]

Aaaawwww Maaan

Really

Thats a lot to digest, for Win7.

Would it be worthwhile, to get the program itself for Windows Vista in CD-ROM format, or get it emailed to me, or something.
Im lost now.