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gas price thread
- Thread starter truckerzero
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docnjoj
1 GW
Thats incredably cheep! Is it the Hydro?
otherDoc
otherDoc
truckerzero
100 W
one question on lifepo4 batterys how many cycles do you get before getting 80 percent original capacity i thought it was 500 just like most other lithium batts the highest claim ive ever heard of is 2000
or are the manufacturers just scared of claiming higher numbers because if you can get 5,000 to 7,000 cycles that would make lifepo4 batterys just as cheap per mile as comparable sla or at least in the same ballpark
ps im a sla type guy but would concider lifepo4 batts if the cost per mile over the life of the batt was within double the cost per mile of sla
or are the manufacturers just scared of claiming higher numbers because if you can get 5,000 to 7,000 cycles that would make lifepo4 batterys just as cheap per mile as comparable sla or at least in the same ballpark
ps im a sla type guy but would concider lifepo4 batts if the cost per mile over the life of the batt was within double the cost per mile of sla
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mcstar
100 W
Oh shoot! Maybe I wasn't supposed to say anything yet about that yet. Well now that I've let the cat out, the number of recharges on some LiFePo4s may only be 1000-2000. Perhaps this is true of the Chinese packs, and I've been assuming that number since that's what they claim. I have some of these and even though I'm extremely happy with them, they are of a cheaper quality and the materials are just good enough to hold the whole thing together. But, I found out recently that the LifeBatt style batteries that are being made for the hybrid and full electric cars have been tested by the DOE to still have over 80% of capacity after 7000 recharges and that's discharging at 30amps continuous per cell. So, it seems the design of the cell has much to do with the lifespan. True, these test were done in near perfect laboratory conditions, so perhaps temperature, moisture and shock will have an affect on the real world life of them. I suppose in about 20 years we'll know for sure.
barabranch
100 µW
- Joined
- Mar 27, 2008
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- 8
why include the cost of electricity for charging? i don't get any bill for electric power usage at my storage.. its free so there by increasing the savings of lifepo. i have travel over 400 miles on my bike at no cost
TylerDurden
100 GW
Schwarzenegger says feeding oil addiction no answer
By Jim Loney
MIAMI (Reuters) - Republican California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger said on Friday that politicians who suggest that lifting a ban on offshore oil drilling would ease rising fuel prices in the United States were "blowing smoke."
The comments were seen by the U.S. media as a slap at Republican leaders including President George W. Bush and the party's presumptive presidential nominee John McCain, who have recently spoken in favor of more offshore drilling as America tries to wean itself from its dependence on foreign oil.
A spokesman for the governor, however, said the comments were not directed at McCain, nor at Florida Gov. Charlie Crist, who has backed McCain's stance on offshore drilling.
Rising oil prices and record-high $4-a-gallon gasoline and their impact on the faltering U.S. economy have put energy concerns squarely at the center of the contest between McCain and Democrat Barack Obama in November.
Speaking at a climate change gathering of politicians and business leaders hosted by fellow Republican Crist, Schwarzenegger said politicians have been "throwing around all kinds of ideas in response to the skyrocketing energy crisis, from rethinking nuclear power to pushing biofuels and more renewables and ending the ban on offshore drilling."
"Anyone who tells you that this will bring down our gas prices immediately or any time soon is blowing smoke," he said. "America is so addicted to oil it will take us years to wean ourselves from it and to look for new ways to feed our addiction is not the answer."
Schwarzenegger's press secretary Aaron McLear said the comments were not a swipe at fellow Republicans for the simple reason that they had not claimed more offshore drilling would immediately lower gasoline prices.
"The governor was not referring to Gov. Crist or Sen. McCain when he said those who suggested offshore oil drilling would lower gas prices are misguided. Neither have suggested that to be the case," McLear said.
ENERGY PLAN
McCain has embraced offshore drilling in recent days and proposed a plan to build 45 new nuclear power plants by 2030. Obama has criticized McCain's drilling stance, and instead has advocated a plan to slap new taxes on oil company profits.
Crist, who has been mentioned as a possible Republican vice presidential candidate, recently supported McCain's call for an end to the federal moratorium on offshore drilling.
His support, criticized by some newspapers and leaders, strayed from decades of opposition to offshore drilling by Florida residents and politicians, including President Bush's younger brother, Jeb, who preceded Crist as governor.
McCain qualified his position, saying states should decide individually on offshore drilling, and Crist appeared to moderate his at the climate conference on Wednesday when he said drilling would only be acceptable if it were safe, far enough from shore and clean enough for the state's beaches.
Crist said he had not talked to Schwarzenegger about the offshore drilling issue at the climate change meeting but brushed off the "blowing smoke" comment, telling Reuters: "I think he was talking about the fact that we need to diversify all of our energy alternatives in order for it to have a comprehensive and lasting effect and I would agree with that."
At the same gathering last year, Crist announced a comprehensive greenhouse gas reduction program for Florida patterned on California's plans for cleaner cars, expansion of renewable energy sources and caps on polluting industries.
California, which has led the U.S. global warming fight in the absence of federal action, unveiled details on Thursday of an ambitious blueprint to counter climate change, aiming to reduce pollutants by 10 percent from current levels by 2020.
It includes a cap-and-trade program for carbon dioxide emissions, requires oil companies to make cleaner fuels and utilities to provide 33 percent of their energy from renewable sources like wind and solar.
"This is going to be something the world will be watching very closely," Schwarzenegger said.
By Jim Loney
MIAMI (Reuters) - Republican California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger said on Friday that politicians who suggest that lifting a ban on offshore oil drilling would ease rising fuel prices in the United States were "blowing smoke."
The comments were seen by the U.S. media as a slap at Republican leaders including President George W. Bush and the party's presumptive presidential nominee John McCain, who have recently spoken in favor of more offshore drilling as America tries to wean itself from its dependence on foreign oil.
A spokesman for the governor, however, said the comments were not directed at McCain, nor at Florida Gov. Charlie Crist, who has backed McCain's stance on offshore drilling.
Rising oil prices and record-high $4-a-gallon gasoline and their impact on the faltering U.S. economy have put energy concerns squarely at the center of the contest between McCain and Democrat Barack Obama in November.
Speaking at a climate change gathering of politicians and business leaders hosted by fellow Republican Crist, Schwarzenegger said politicians have been "throwing around all kinds of ideas in response to the skyrocketing energy crisis, from rethinking nuclear power to pushing biofuels and more renewables and ending the ban on offshore drilling."
"Anyone who tells you that this will bring down our gas prices immediately or any time soon is blowing smoke," he said. "America is so addicted to oil it will take us years to wean ourselves from it and to look for new ways to feed our addiction is not the answer."
Schwarzenegger's press secretary Aaron McLear said the comments were not a swipe at fellow Republicans for the simple reason that they had not claimed more offshore drilling would immediately lower gasoline prices.
"The governor was not referring to Gov. Crist or Sen. McCain when he said those who suggested offshore oil drilling would lower gas prices are misguided. Neither have suggested that to be the case," McLear said.
ENERGY PLAN
McCain has embraced offshore drilling in recent days and proposed a plan to build 45 new nuclear power plants by 2030. Obama has criticized McCain's drilling stance, and instead has advocated a plan to slap new taxes on oil company profits.
Crist, who has been mentioned as a possible Republican vice presidential candidate, recently supported McCain's call for an end to the federal moratorium on offshore drilling.
His support, criticized by some newspapers and leaders, strayed from decades of opposition to offshore drilling by Florida residents and politicians, including President Bush's younger brother, Jeb, who preceded Crist as governor.
McCain qualified his position, saying states should decide individually on offshore drilling, and Crist appeared to moderate his at the climate conference on Wednesday when he said drilling would only be acceptable if it were safe, far enough from shore and clean enough for the state's beaches.
Crist said he had not talked to Schwarzenegger about the offshore drilling issue at the climate change meeting but brushed off the "blowing smoke" comment, telling Reuters: "I think he was talking about the fact that we need to diversify all of our energy alternatives in order for it to have a comprehensive and lasting effect and I would agree with that."
At the same gathering last year, Crist announced a comprehensive greenhouse gas reduction program for Florida patterned on California's plans for cleaner cars, expansion of renewable energy sources and caps on polluting industries.
California, which has led the U.S. global warming fight in the absence of federal action, unveiled details on Thursday of an ambitious blueprint to counter climate change, aiming to reduce pollutants by 10 percent from current levels by 2020.
It includes a cap-and-trade program for carbon dioxide emissions, requires oil companies to make cleaner fuels and utilities to provide 33 percent of their energy from renewable sources like wind and solar.
"This is going to be something the world will be watching very closely," Schwarzenegger said.
dirty_d
10 kW
too bad he cant be president. not only does he look at the big picture, but your president would be the freakin terminator!
TylerDurden
100 GW
California gasoline consumption fell in March -state
Mon Jun 30, 1:53 PM ET
HOUSTON (Reuters) - California drivers, who pay some of the highest prices in the nation for gasoline, purchased 3.2 percent less of the fuel in March compared to the same month a year ago, the State Board of Equalization said on Monday.
Diesel consumption dropped 12.4 percent in the same period, according to a statement from the board, which regulates state sales taxes.
Gasoline consumption in March of this year was 1.31 billion gallons, or 31.2 million barrels, compared to 1.35 billion gallons, or 32.2 million barrels, a year ago.
On-road diesel sold in California during March 2008 was 241.4 million gallons, or 5.75 million barrels, down from 275.6 million gallons, or 6.56 million barrels, in the same month of 2007, according to the board.
State Board of Equalization statistics, which are based on sales tax receipts from fuel distributors, have shown declines since the state's gasoline prices regularly topped $3.00 a gallon in latter half of 2007.
Average gasoline prices rose from $3.23 per gallon to $3.61 a gallon from February to March of this year, said the board.
The U.S. West Coast is almost entirely dependent on production from the region's refineries or imports from overseas refineries.
How do you reduce diesel consumption by >12%?... That's a lot of truckers going a lot slower.
Mon Jun 30, 1:53 PM ET
HOUSTON (Reuters) - California drivers, who pay some of the highest prices in the nation for gasoline, purchased 3.2 percent less of the fuel in March compared to the same month a year ago, the State Board of Equalization said on Monday.
Diesel consumption dropped 12.4 percent in the same period, according to a statement from the board, which regulates state sales taxes.
Gasoline consumption in March of this year was 1.31 billion gallons, or 31.2 million barrels, compared to 1.35 billion gallons, or 32.2 million barrels, a year ago.
On-road diesel sold in California during March 2008 was 241.4 million gallons, or 5.75 million barrels, down from 275.6 million gallons, or 6.56 million barrels, in the same month of 2007, according to the board.
State Board of Equalization statistics, which are based on sales tax receipts from fuel distributors, have shown declines since the state's gasoline prices regularly topped $3.00 a gallon in latter half of 2007.
Average gasoline prices rose from $3.23 per gallon to $3.61 a gallon from February to March of this year, said the board.
The U.S. West Coast is almost entirely dependent on production from the region's refineries or imports from overseas refineries.
How do you reduce diesel consumption by >12%?... That's a lot of truckers going a lot slower.
jerryt
100 W
Yup, we Californians are riding our bikes & boycotting them profiteers!
I'm retired and down to one tankful every 40-50 days or less.
recumpence
1 GW
So, I have a gripe.............
Why is it that many bicycle guys (in general) are against assist? I get a few guys here and there that are against assist. However, those "Pedal only" devoties have no problem driving a huge SUV. They say strange things like "I need the room to carry my bike/s." I find that odd. I say "I can ride my assisted bike along the 40mph roads to get to the best riding areas so I don't need to use my car. Plus I get more exercise with my assisted bike than my non-assisted bike primarily because I do not burn myself out on the hills (I do pedal most of the time on the flats). And I can go over 2,000 miles on the same $4.20 one gallon of gas costs. Besides, why not drive a small car and use a bike rack?
Then some assist guys ask why I have so much power. "Why not just use a couple hundred watts to help a little on the hills?"
They just don't get it.
Sorry for the rant. I just don't understand the logic.
Matt
Why is it that many bicycle guys (in general) are against assist? I get a few guys here and there that are against assist. However, those "Pedal only" devoties have no problem driving a huge SUV. They say strange things like "I need the room to carry my bike/s." I find that odd. I say "I can ride my assisted bike along the 40mph roads to get to the best riding areas so I don't need to use my car. Plus I get more exercise with my assisted bike than my non-assisted bike primarily because I do not burn myself out on the hills (I do pedal most of the time on the flats). And I can go over 2,000 miles on the same $4.20 one gallon of gas costs. Besides, why not drive a small car and use a bike rack?
Then some assist guys ask why I have so much power. "Why not just use a couple hundred watts to help a little on the hills?"
They just don't get it.
Sorry for the rant. I just don't understand the logic.
Matt
paultrafalgar
10 kW
Agree with your sentiment entirely, Matt, but I'm curious to know EXACTLY what your answer is to guys who ask:
"Why not just use a couple hundred watts to help a little on the hills?"
Reason I am curious is that I didn't read the very interesting "55mph Club" thread because I thought it was for lunatics wanting to do 55 mph on their bikes! :lol:
whereas it's to do with cars.
I think you're going to say that by being able to go a decent (if illegal) speed, you make it much more likely that folks will use their ebikes for commuting in place of their cars. Am I right?
"Why not just use a couple hundred watts to help a little on the hills?"
Reason I am curious is that I didn't read the very interesting "55mph Club" thread because I thought it was for lunatics wanting to do 55 mph on their bikes! :lol:
whereas it's to do with cars.I think you're going to say that by being able to go a decent (if illegal) speed, you make it much more likely that folks will use their ebikes for commuting in place of their cars. Am I right?
Kraeuterbutter
100 W
- Joined
- Jun 14, 2007
- Messages
- 197
some sport-bikers (who drive bikes for sport-reason)
investe mucho money into light components..
additional 100$ just for 50g lighter pedals
additional 150$ just for a saddel/seat that is 40g lighter
and so on, and so on..
so they are searching for every single gramm of weight were they can safe, so they come to 10kg or less with ther mountainbike
then of course its rediculous for them to ad 5000g, 7000g or more to there bike in form of motor + battery
when they just spent 3000-4000US$ to get a light bike which is maybe 2000g lighter than cheaper bikes
for gas-price:
the dollar vs euro: 1,5764 : 1
i paid 1.52 Euro for a liter of Super Benzin last week
-> thats: 2.39US$ for a liter
so: a Gallone of Super Benzin here in Austria costs 9.08 US$ !!!
investe mucho money into light components..
additional 100$ just for 50g lighter pedals
additional 150$ just for a saddel/seat that is 40g lighter
and so on, and so on..
so they are searching for every single gramm of weight were they can safe, so they come to 10kg or less with ther mountainbike
then of course its rediculous for them to ad 5000g, 7000g or more to there bike in form of motor + battery
when they just spent 3000-4000US$ to get a light bike which is maybe 2000g lighter than cheaper bikes
for gas-price:
the dollar vs euro: 1,5764 : 1
i paid 1.52 Euro for a liter of Super Benzin last week
-> thats: 2.39US$ for a liter
so: a Gallone of Super Benzin here in Austria costs 9.08 US$ !!!
Kraeuterbutter
100 W
- Joined
- Jun 14, 2007
- Messages
- 197
well: e-bikes ARE cheating...
Kraeuterbutter
100 W
- Joined
- Jun 14, 2007
- Messages
- 197
my posting was the answer to this...
and compared to gearing ebikes are cheating, because additional energy from batts/motors are brought to the bike
gearing for that is no cheating for me, because its still your powerinput allone that brings you up a hill
on e-bikes there is additional power
(on some this is very much higher than the power you put in)
for that its cheating..
which does not mean, that this is a bad thing...
when i can go for a ride with 190puls and my girlfriend can keep up with me because she has electric assist, this would be great
Kraeuterbutter
100 W
- Joined
- Jun 14, 2007
- Messages
- 197
maybe i don´t understand the word "cheating" right way ?
(English was always my worst class at school (besides Latin))
when i go up a hill with an electric assists and go ahead of an cyclist on a racing bicycle and he shouts: "hey, thats cheating"
than he was right..
(English was always my worst class at school (besides Latin))
when i go up a hill with an electric assists and go ahead of an cyclist on a racing bicycle and he shouts: "hey, thats cheating"
than he was right..
Would he shout the same at a motorcyclist? If not, why not? Was he smiling?
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cheat
Of course, if you do everything you can to hide the existence of your pedal assistance and glide past the cyclist with a self-satisfied smirk, then.....
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cheat
Of course, if you do everything you can to hide the existence of your pedal assistance and glide past the cyclist with a self-satisfied smirk, then.....
Kraeuterbutter
100 W
- Joined
- Jun 14, 2007
- Messages
- 197
@Miles: motorcyclist is a complete other leage..
the law sees a electric pedelec as a bicycle and not a motorcycle
and also the people does do that..
there are videos on youtube, were people show, how a ebike with an old many compares with an athletic cyclist on a hill,
or how a italien cyclist - also oder age - is driving a competition-race with professional bike-racers up a mountain, ....
so pedelecs are always compared with normal bikes which are driven by muscels alown and not with motorcycles..
and for that its in my option cheating (but with good means)
the law sees a electric pedelec as a bicycle and not a motorcycle
and also the people does do that..
there are videos on youtube, were people show, how a ebike with an old many compares with an athletic cyclist on a hill,
or how a italien cyclist - also oder age - is driving a competition-race with professional bike-racers up a mountain, ....
so pedelecs are always compared with normal bikes which are driven by muscels alown and not with motorcycles..
and for that its in my option cheating
(but with good means)
vanilla ice
1 MW
I think I would reserve the word for cases of deceit or where someone is being deprived of something. Anyway, your modest proposal for a 100 Watt system can only be half-cheating....Kraeuterbutter said:...and for that its in my option cheating
vanilla ice
1 MW
In my experience the few people who ever have negatives comments are all bikers. I think these bikers are the peeps who most want to like ebikes, but just cant allow themselves to. Otherwise, why even take the energy to spout off. Its like an internal conflict, I can hear it in their heads, "Cheater!.. Yes it is cheating. Definately is. Must not accept those. Not a true bicycle." I agree with Mark about the bad reasoning. Jump in the Ford Explodition drive up to your favorite riding spot, no problems. But put a powerful motor on a bicycle? Blasphemer!! And the comment about the expensive ultra-light components, that might have somethign to do with it also, when you've got so much invested (money and thinking) in one way of doing things, and somebody comes along and shatters that, it can be upsetting I guess.
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