Qulbix Raptor 140

[Mammalian04]

are you planning to put the nord washer before or after the aluminum spacer? between the bolt and the spacer, pretty sure not enough space.

Offroader placed his directly against the bearing on his Raptor 165, as seen in the picture below.
View attachment 4

The swingarm bearing hole diameter is a little over 28mm. The Outside Diameter (OD) of the original spacer is 27mm. As such, a M8 Nord-Lock with OD of 16.6mm should fit fine.



All that being said, the diameter of the part of Qulbix's tapered spacer that actually touches the bearing is about 16.5mm-17mm. This is about the same as the large OD Nord-Lock referenced above. However, it seems like that is contacting the black part of the bearing, and not just the inner silver colored part that spins. It seems to me like that would be a problem. Do I have this wrong?
View attachment 1

For the bolt, I measured the depth of the hole using an allen wrench. It goes in 44mm starting at the bearing. Each M8 Nord-Lock is 2.5mm. 2 of them is 5mm. The 44mm hole plus the 5mm = 49mm. I will try a M8 x 1.25 x 45mm.

Offroader (or anyone else), do you recall the pinch-bolt size? I am ordering up some Nordlock but I am not near the bike.

Lastly, I tried to get the calipers in there to measure the pinch bolts without breaking them loose and taking them out. They look like they are 5mm so M5. I'll update my previous post with a link to the M5 nord-lock. These should NOT be the large OD version.

 

[Offroader]

If you are going to use nord lock washers you can't use the aluminum spacers because the nord lock would not work properly.

I order my nord locks from here if in USA, but you should find the cheapest place you can. I always get the zinc coated steel.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#nord-lock-washers/=12xuskd

 

[Mammalian04]

So I took the swingarm off. I was able to tap the hole (M8x1.25) to about 33mm.

The swingarm bearing is about 12mm and about another 2.5 for the pair of M8 nordlock washers, making about 14.5mm. 33mm +14.5mm = 47.5mm.

47.5mm of depth makes it perfect for a M8x1.25x45mm bolt but... The 45mm bolts I found at home depot have a non-threaded shoulder that JUST barely passes the depth of the bearing and nordlock washers. I tried to thread the bolt a bit farther with my crappy harbor freight die set and it didn't want to go.
As a side note, I think I should go with a softer 8.8 grade bolt. Better to ruin the bolt than the frame, as I already discovered. Unfortunately, this is all Home Depot had.

Here you can see the bolt shoulder is about 15.5mm and I only had 14.4mm before the swingarm threads start. This makes the bolt stop before the swingarm is tightened in.


So... I need to get a softer bolt and extend the threads about 1mm or get a bolt with all threads.

Of course, this is all to prevent the bolt from stripping out the threads like it did with the stock 25mm bolt. I just hope the additional 25mm I added is enough. Even tapped deeper, the bolts doesn't feed snug. I will probably need to take Offroaders advice and add the Helicoil. I have never used one before and don't have the insertion tool. Might just take it to a machine shop to have that sorted... I think the only other solution is to drill it out and weld in a new nut (I really don't like that idea)...

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Mammalian04]

I am thinking about converting one of my 140s over to a higher speed, shorter suspension travel, super moto for street only with license plate and all. What do ya'll think about putting a QS273 on the Raptor with the new dropout reinforcement brackets. Will it hold up with a 14KW Adaptto?

Is there a better platform to start with than the 140?

 

[Rix]

I am thinking about converting one of my 140s over to a higher speed, shorter suspension travel, super moto for street only with license plate and all. What do ya'll think about putting a QS273 on the Raptor with the new dropout reinforcement brackets. Will it hold up with a 14KW Adaptto?

Is there a better platform to start with than the 140?

it will hold up with careful component selection. I wouldn't use anything but DH MTB components. The 140 has a low BB, compared to other DIY options, but I know guys like Offroader that have ran off road with no issues, so your on road SUMO set up wont be an issue.

 

[spinningmagnets]

For 14kW, you might need a longer swing-arm to suppress wheelies.

 

[Rix]

For 14kW, you might need a longer swing-arm to suppress wheelies.

YAH! Wheelies!!!!!!!!!!! Bring it? Then control it!! Spinner is right with controlling the wheelie factor.

 

[Merlin]

iam on 16KW adaptto and when you dont want, just lean a bit forward and there wheelies nothing

if you want to run on street for a long time on higher power level i think sabvotons big blocks are the better way because adaptto maxe is 18fet and sabvotons are 24fet ...
the alu cooling plate on the backside itself has the weight of a complete max-e

 

[Mammalian04]

That's a good point. Though, I was just trying to keep things simple by only having Adaptto controllers. Even though I hate setup, at least I am somewhat familiar with the Adapttos now. I don't really enjoy the build process and definately not the setup, I just want to ride! Regarding the wheelies, I think that the Adaptto's can tune that out with ramp up but I'm not too worried as I am coming from liter sport bikes so throttle control on smooth streets shouldn't hard with a decent domino throttle.

Maybe I can get QS to set up the Sabvoton and wiring ahead of time with a Cycle Analyst so it is plug and play!

 

[Offroader]

I am thinking about converting one of my 140s over to a higher speed, shorter suspension travel, super moto for street only with license plate and all. What do ya'll think about putting a QS273 on the Raptor with the new dropout reinforcement brackets. Will it hold up with a 14KW Adaptto?

Is there a better platform to start with than the 140?

it will hold up with careful component selection. I wouldn't use anything but DH MTB components. The 140 has a low BB, compared to other DIY options, but I know guys like Offroader that have ran off road with no issues, so your on road SUMO set up wont be an issue.

My BB height is around 14.2 - 14.5" on my Q76R, which is high. I think my old bike was around 13.8" at the lowest. This is with a 17" rear wheel.

I think the problem with low BB height are the people who use 19" rim in the front. I use a 26" front wheel and that keeps everything up high.

 

[Mammalian04]

This one will have moto pegs only so lower would actually be better. I am thinking 19" front and rear if I can get the 273 in a 19"... Street only tires too.

 

[Merlin]

for street only + footpegs i would go with 17" front and rear.

like all (street) motorcycles

 

[Mammalian04]

Good point. Tires...

 

[Mammalian04]

Was this LightningRods post or someone else?

This was recently published on the ES Facebook page. A Qulbix Raptor 140 with a Lightning Rods "Big Block" motor and #219 chain primary drive.

View attachment 1

 

[Mammalian04]

I like internal controllers so lose a bit of battery space, but if going with an external controller I've found you can actually fit up to 21S28P....

...This is it in 2 14P halves.

Hyena, do you have any photos showing the cell layout of those batteries? I am thinking about building a could of those. 20s14p for each 140 but then I can put them together if need be (probably won't ever do that though).

 

[ziltoid81]

Both sides.

Happened on flat road (at least i noticed it yesterday), i never did something crazy with the bike.
Zero to none offroad use, its my commuter.

It sucks cause i need it every day.

I weigh in at 80kg raw.....maybe 5kg backpack.

If you put pressure on the saddle it opens wider.

 

[Rix]

Yah, Ziltoid, its called fatigue. The exact same thing happened to me on my Bomber. Tell qulbix about it, they will need to go with a little thicker material to remedy this.

 

[ziltoid81]

Mail is out.
Hope they have some sort of reinforced replacement...otherwise it will fail again, when im out of warranty.
Or maybe you have to starve yourself down to 60kg to ride a raptor.
They should put that on their website. :wink:

Im not the first one with the issue.

I never thought that part could fail.......i mean were talking bout steel......my skinny lightweight aluminium cannondale frame took way more abuse without failing.
Offroad abuse......

Maybe its only a small batch of seat brackets with a different steel or what not.
It would suck if its a constructional problem.

 

[Offroader]

Damn, this is the first issue I've seen these frames have. What is your weight?

 

[Mammalian04]

Well that's scary... It makes me want to think twice about the hard landings.

 

[Rix]

Well that's scary... It makes me want to think twice about the hard landings.

This is an excellent example of the great characteristics of cromo steel, when the steel lets go, it does so slowly and not all at once. This is one reason why Stealth uses cromolly steel sheets for their frames. Don't be alarmed guys. this kind of failure warns the rider. Gives plenty of time to correct.

 

[ziltoid81]

Damn, this is the first issue I've seen these frames have. What is your weight?

There is already a thread about this particular issue. ........just look at my postings and you will find it.
So i am not the first one.

And again im a 80kg guy.

 

[litespeed]

Well that's scary... It makes me want to think twice about the hard landings.

This is an excellent example of the great characteristics of cromo steel, when the steel lets go, it does so slowly and not all at once. This is one reason why Stealth uses cromolly steel sheets for their frames. Don't be alarmed guys. this kind of failure warns the rider. Gives plenty of time to correct.

Rix,

Sorry i respectfully disagree but cromoly steel usually breaks not slowly crack. I think your confused with mild steel. That is why most roll cages/tube frames use mild steel because they bend and don't break. Crome is harder, stronger so it can be used as lighter material but not ideal for all cases. Does really bad in high vibration areas, ask me how I know. Well at least mild steel does good until it work hardens and then anything can happen.

In my opinion I think the frames are OK for crome but think the seat mount should be mild steel sized accordingly and would
never have this issue.

Tom

 

[Merlin]

let us know what ziva will tell you.

this is from my sight of seeing a warranty case not only for a year or two.
this is a construction "mistake" and they have to be happy that you are still living.

if i were QULBIX, i would send you immediately a NEW one + a present!



i dont know how many frames they sold allready. i have my third raptor and weight 10kg more...but the first 2 was 165 frames.
my 140 has only 1000km on it(yet)

man, iam so snoopy now...i will ask her too.

 

[ziltoid81]

I still ride this thing.......unfortunately i need the bike every day.
My cannondale is at my parents place, maybe i get there tomorrow.

I lowered the seatpost till it hits the rear shock.
I put some plastic part between the shock and the seatpost to save the shock from scratches.
I hope it will take a good amount of force from the seat bracket.

I showed the crack at work to some mechanics and they told me they can weld it, or they would try.
But i need a replacement first, cause i dont want the bike to be a construction site again.

No reply sor far, will send another email to qulbix tonight.

My biggest concern is that this may be a constructional fault and it only will take xxxx kilometers till it fails again.

This is a commuter, i ride a lot km.