Another Cooling a Currie/Mongoose/Unite MY1018Z thread

[safe]

It's good to see this thread revived...

The "debate" over how best to increase power with small motors hasn't changed that much since this was first started.

I'll have my Armature Current Limiting (ACL formerly called MCL) circuit parts on Monday and within a week or two I'll have them built. It's still too early to go out and test, so it's probably months away before the final results can come in.

My target is 45 mph using a MY1016Z3 and so if that target is achieved then you can do the backwards math to figure out that I did something right.

If the motor fails to achieve 45 mph (or it burns up really quickly) then maybe my aspirations for more power will be for nothing.

The good news is that we WILL eventually have an answer...

 

[TylerDurden]

Some researchers test in the lab before testing in the field...

:?

 

[safe]

Some researchers test in the lab before testing in the field...

Can you think of a way to test an ACL circuit without a dyno?

The current is "sensed" by a Hall Effect sensor and you need real current to know if it's working properly.

Also... I don't even have the bike built yet. (no bike, then no testing)

However, I was going to try it on my old bike so maybe I might be able to verify that the ACL circuit works before I can verify if the MY1016Z3 machine is a success. But on my old bike I don't need it because I'm running the bigger 1000 watt motor right now that cools really well. (it's a surprisingly well built motor)

 

[TylerDurden]

Turbo trainer, mag-trainer, etc.

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/bik/506242063.html

You can find em at goodwill, etc. about $20

 

[davespicer]

Found an article discussing the effects of paint on the heat-transfer properties of equipment cases. Looks like the outside of the case would best be painted white and the inside flat black... wonder if this would help these motors too?

 

[TylerDurden]

Looks like the outside of the case would best be painted white and the inside flat black... wonder if this would help these motors too?

It would help, but I don't think the difference could be measured outside of a lab.

It's paramount to cool those pesky windings... air, air and more air!

 

[docnjoj]

Hey davespicer! It looks like U must be a member of that group to access stuff!
otherDoc

 

[davespicer]

Hey davespicer! It looks like U must be a member of that group to access stuff!
otherDoc

Huh?

 

[TylerDurden]

Hey davespicer! It looks like U must be a member of that group to access stuff!
otherDoc

Huh?

Looks like IEEE req's a subscription for pdf download...

 

[vanilla ice]

I think the layer o paint's insulation properties would negate all and more of the black body radiating stuff. Unless you're talking over 200 F, and you use a specific thinned blk paint for radiators, then maybe it will help. And I think you would want black on both the inside and outside, unless you live in new mexico.

 

[EcoForumZ]

Thanks for the post TD. I already began the work but thanks to your directions and pictures I will save myself some trouble. Gotta love the spring loaded magnets

 

[tropmonky]

I was wondering how the gear reduction works on these units? Would it be possible to fit a brushless in place of the brushed motor???

I was thinking the Mongoose CX200 would make a good platform to hack and wack into something faster, has anyone done something other than just over volting?


Thanks guys! Love this place!

Kyle

 

[Link]

It's a pretty simply reduction. Just a smaller spur gear on the armature spinning a larger one it meshes to. The larger gear is attached to a sprocket that connects through a chain to another sprocket on the wheel.

I don't think you could put in a brushless without some pretty extensive work. The gearbox is part of the motor case, so you'd have to cut it off and fab up a mount for the new motor.

 

[vanilla ice]

I was thinking the Mongoose CX200 would make a good platform to hack

IIRC the cx200 has a POS direct drive little motor. Not the one we're talking about here in the cx450. Any higher than what the motor can take and I'd be worried about stripping the pinion gear. IMo best leave it be, anyway it can take quite a bit. And you can always swap for one of the huge rear sprockets for a non-geared motor swap. A few members here have done that.

 

[tropmonky]

IIRC the cx200 has a POS direct drive little motor. Not the one we're talking about here in the cx450. Any higher than what the motor can take and I'd be worried about stripping the pinion gear. IMo best leave it be, anyway it can take quite a bit. And you can always swap for one of the huge rear sprockets for a non-geared motor swap. A few members here have done that.

Good to know! Being I would replace all that it would be cheaper to start with a CX200 then I suppose.

Kyle

 

[davespicer]

Meme of the week: Never giving you up, letting you down, or running around and deserting you.

Aaugh! An indirect Rickroll

 

[docnjoj]

Remember that the CX450 has a true rear suspension, but the CX200 just springs the seat to the solid frame! I used only the rear suspension of the 450 to power my trike and it comes off easy! Bikeraider made a killer off road bike out of a 450! Its only 50 bucks more!
otherDoc

 

[donob08]

I've been looking at the Unite page (http://en.unitemotor.com/ProductView_41.html). They talk about a 250 watt version and a 450 watt version of the MY1018. Is this discussion directed toward the 250 W version as far as results?

 

[Link]

Meme of the week: Never giving you up, letting you down, or running around and deserting you.

Aaugh! An indirect Rickroll

:wink:

I'll be adding what links I can to the memes in question from now on.

 

[TylerDurden]

I've been looking at the Unite page (http://en.unitemotor.com/ProductView_41.html). They talk about a 250 watt version and a 450 watt version of the MY1018. Is this discussion directed toward the 250 W version as far as results?

I have been modding the stock currie motor (but any motor benefits from cooling).

The link does show a difference in no-load speeds, so an alternate winding may have been produced. That said, Unite has numerous sites, pages and documents with conflicting information.

 

[TylerDurden]

If someone here who has a 1018 from TNC wants to post a closeup pic of their armature, we can compare it to a stock currie for wire gauge and possibly winding count.

 

[bluthermal]

I had to return my first burnt up original motor (24V 450W). But I[m expecting it's replacement in the near future. Maybe I can get pics then. The other motor I will compare it to is my burnt up 36V 250W motor from TNC scooters. I'm not sure if that is a valid comparison, since it might be better to compare to a 24V 250W motor.

I emailed Chris at TNCscooters last week, and he says that they expect to have 36V 450W motors in August. I did not ask about 24V 450W motors, but I expect they will have them too. He is the person who told me about Currie's one year exclusive on the Unite MY1018 450W geared motors, which has apparently expired now.

From my experience, I believe there are (and have been) two versions, with only Currie providing the 450W versions up to this point. I noticed a power and speed difference between the 24V 450W running at 24V (which felt faster and more powerful) and the 36V 250W running at 36V (which felt slower and more sluggish). Then when I saw the specs between the two eventually show up on Unite's website, that also clinched it for me.

 

[bluthermal]

I received my replacement 24V 450W geared motor from Currie (like Unite MY 1018). I took 5 pictures of the windings, etc. I can't figure out how to attach them without placing them on some URL somewhere, or maybe they are too big (about 2.50MB each jpegs).

The windings look to me like those pictured in this thread of Tyler's Currie motor. To me, they look different than the windings of Reid's (TNC Unite 24V 250W) as shown in pictures of his blow dryer cooling modification thread.

 

[vanilla ice]

We can do an ES exchange program to match up pairs of similar motors for those wanting to go dually.. :lol:

 

[docnjoj]

Hey Bluthermal! Knock those Pics down to less than 1meg and they will post OK I usually go 700x900 or so!
otherDoc