This man may change the world Andrea Rossi & eCat

for those interested to read what other people think about this and the link with NASA
http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/12/01/15/0226219/can-nasa-warm-cold-fusion?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Slashdot%2FslashdotScience+%28Slashdot%3A+Science%29

I like Slashdot, with their ranking system, they managed to get most of the good posts on top, also the funny one, and you decide at which level you want to dig in.
 
A new twist today... http://www.defkalion-energy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=926

So now "the other guy" is hosting independent labs to come to Greece and test their LENR reactor in situ...

Please note the following Press Release of 23/1/2012 on Invitation for Indepentent Testing of Hyperion Reactors to appear also in http://www.defkalion-energy.com/news .

All requests or related questions will be answered only through our e-mail.

DGT


Independent Testing on Hyperion Reactors

Praxen Defkalion Green Technologies Global Ltd. (PDGT) is ready to further allow third parties to evaluate its core technology: a multi stage LENR reaction between Nickel and Hydrogen.

PDGT has successfully completed its scientific, technological and engineering steps necessary to sustain such a reaction with results exceeding a COP of 20 and with temperatures capable to exceed 650 degrees Celsius.

As it was announced in our November 30th Press Release, a series of third party tests on Hyperion products have been scheduled to be performed within the first months of 2012, immediately after our product’s certification. The present announcement does not refer to such product tests.

With this announcement, PDGT welcomes further requests from internationally recognized and reputable scientific and business organizations interested to conduct their independent tests on “bare” Hyperion Reactors. Such independent tests have already been scheduled.

Tests will be conducted following mutually agreed protocols based on the general principles herein.

Test Objectives
• Measurement of excess heat produced by reactions within Hyperion reactors
• Measurement of “bare” Hyperion Reactor COP (i.e. total energy consumed versus energy produced)
• Measurement of radioactivity during testing
• Measurement of reactor’s stability using its control mechanisms

Type of Testing

Parallel run of two identical Hyperion Reactors connected in parallel to the same electric energy sources for pre-heating and the same Hydrogen input source.
The active Reactor #1 will be equipped and prepared ready to trigger and sustain a steady reaction.
The Reactor #2 will be empty of any powders and with all triggering and control mechanisms deactivated.
Following a parallel test run of both Reactors for at least 48 hours, the two Reactors will be switched for a second run (Reactor #1 empty and Reactor #2 active) in order to authenticate the same results.

Configuration & Measurements

Both Reactors are of the same configuration, placed in the same room with a 50-60cm distance from each other.
Both reactors will be identically isolated.

Calibrated thermocouples of the same type will be connected inside each Reactor chamber and attached in the outer surface of each reactor. All four thermocouples will report their measurements to the same data logger and PC logging software.

The pressure of the Hydrogen circuit will be monitored and logged with the same sample rate as the thermocouples logging (i.e. 1/sec).

All electric consuming devises attached to the Reactors will be measured and logged (Volt and Amps). All electric supplies to the reactors will be through a UPS unit to avoid grid problems and any possible fluctuations.

Monitoring of any type of radioactivity from the tested Reactors will be performed following a 24hours measurement of the testing environment, to be used as base measurement.

Cooling Method

Cold air may be blown to both Reactors through their isolation if the maximum safety temperature level as defined in the test protocol is reached in the active Reactor.


Measurement Methodologies

1. On Heat Energy and COP
Differential Thermal Analysis:

Following the test run, the Temperature/Time logged plots of inner and outer thermocouples will be used to calculate:
• The difference of integrals between the Temperature/Time logged plots of inner thermocouple measurements of the two Reactors. This results to the calculation of the absolute excess heat energy produced by the active Reactor.
• The difference of integrals between the logged plots of each pair of inner and outer attached thermocouples attached to each Reactor.
• The difference of the respective energy of the absolute excess heat energy produced by the active Reactor versus the total electric energy consumed by the active Reactor (heater and controls). This results in the COP of the active Reactor.
• Reactors will be weighed before and after testing.

2. On Radiation

A Muller-Geiger tube, calibrated to the environment base radiation level, will be used to measure alpha and gamma emissions from the active Reactor.

3. On Stability

The active Reactor’s thermocouples measured temperatures, both inner and on outer surface, will be maintained stable with a fluctuation of no more than +/- 10% during the whole testing period, as observed after the triggering of the reaction in the active Reactor.

4. Other Measurements

No other measurements (e.g. flow calorimetry), will be performed during such “bare” Reactor testing.
The existing already released specifications of Hyperion products relating to system performance, stability, safety and functionality will not be tested during this series if tests.


Reactor’s Performance

It is expected that tests will conclude a COP in excess of 20

Publication of Protocols and Results

The detailed test protocols will be published by PGDT before any third party test is performed.
Test results may be published by the independent evaluators in the media they choose and in our site, jointly.




Following the above, PDGT remains committed to its vision as a pioneer in LENR technology. Hyperion products can be used as a cheap, clean and green energy source for households and industrial applications.

PDGT remains committed to the world at large, providing its technology with responsibility and diligence.


_________________________________________

Praxen Defkalion Green Technologies Global Ltd.
January 23rd 2012
 
They've been quiet for a while.
Here's something from their website:
http://ecat.com/news/andrea-rossi-ecat-march-update

Andrea Rossi ECAT – March update
Here is a summary of the latest ECAT developments made by Andrea Rossi:

•Andrea Rossi has developed a new design of the ECAT Home unit which is 33cm x 33cm x 6cm and can be put vertically or horizontally. Total weight is 10 kg
•The technology is completely changed, new patents have been applied for, an intense testing program is going on with very good result
•Leonardo Corp will defend its Intellectual Property against copycats in all necessary courts
•The new ECAT Home unit has two simple connections for input and output of water
•No pictures will be released until the product is for sale
•By law a customer has 60 days of time to give back the device if unsatisfied, and Leonardo Corp give all the guarantees required by the law
•Production capacity of new factory is one million units per year
•The hydrogen canister has been removed and the hydrogen is now stored inside a solid material due to safety reasons
•There is a new control system for both the ECAT Home unit and the ECAT 1MW Plant which are made from an undisclosed supplier, not National Instruments
•The only certified places to pre-order an ECAT are either Info@leonardocorp1996.com and/or via the order form at ECAT.com
•Certification from UL – Underwriters Laboratories is in process
•The highest temperature that could be achieved in the reactor of the domestic ECAT is just below the melting point of Nickel
•No radiation has ever been detected outside the ECAT
•The ECAT has already got important authorizations
•The COP (Coefficient of Performance) is 6
•Licenses to sell and market ECATs has been granted to licensees, not yet published
•When Leonardo Corporation will execute the commercial strategy, the entire network of the licensees will be published
•Andrea Rossi anticipates that an air conditioned generator and a electricity generator will eventually be suitable accessories for the ECAT
•Siemens has shown an electricity solution for Andrea Rossi with 33% efficiency for 25MWe at 250C, 40bar and a smaller version with 30% efficiency for 5-8MWe also at 250C, 40bar in the secondary circuit

Hmmm... new design? I see they are still taking money. I wonder how long they can maintain investor interest without actually selling a product?
 
Looks like Krivit has pretty much discredited Rossi so far. A compilation here: http://blog.newenergytimes.com/

Now Defkalion went "dark" about a month ago... It has gotten "quiet..."
 
Out of context but this reminds me of the Dire Straits song:

"That ain't working, that's the way you do it
Money for nothing and your chicks for free

Now that ain't working, that's the way you do it
Let me tell you them guys ain't dumb"
 
Thanks for starting this thread Big Moose,
All those naysayers, including physicists, but you worked out there was something in it.
Can i ask your advice as to what to invest in :lol:
Fusion, LENR or both, as they both look close to 100% feasible now for energy production.
Why do we have to wait till the end of the decade until they finish the first commercial fusion reactor, can't they fast track it.
This is one of the latest, supposedly, inside videos, looks promising
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iS4qNbMCBL0&feature=youtube_gdata_player

My first job was at the Daresbury Lab in the UK, working on the construction of a new accelerator.
While it was fairly menial and only for a few months, i was given a tour of the whole facility and the local pub was good too :D.
Lewis Carroll lived in that village, apt considering now, :D.
 
bigmoose said:
Looks like Krivit has pretty much discredited Rossi so far. A compilation here: http://blog.newenergytimes.com/

Now Defkalion went "dark" about a month ago... It has gotten "quiet..."

... and so everything went quiet and remains quiet! Don't have a clue where to invest. I never did too well in the market. It had the possibility that something significant was about to happen. Perhaps, I wanted to have some greater hope for mankind. Funny how Luke PM'd me with all the ways Rossi could have manipulated the tests... and he hit a number of them spot on as more data came out. I then had hope in Defkalion when they offered open testing for 3rd parties... then they pulled that offer.

No 3rd party tests > no independent data > no verification > high probability of either faulty science or potential deception.

Here is a recent you tube video by Defkalion's chief technologist. If you can understand the sketchy audio... [youtube]WWCVFTynRfQ[/youtube]

If the stuff is real, you invite in 3rd party independent laboratories that are credentialed to test it with no restrictions. In a week, if it works, you are a gub-illion-aire...

This leads us back to:
No 3rd party tests > no independent data > no verification > high probability of either faulty science or potential deception.

Oh and for fusion research the meaning of the Larson Miller criteria and see where we are with demonstrated, real, credentialed testing. Your fusion answer resides with that data.
 
Would be good to have a transcript of that, i couldn't really make it out, either the audio is bad or my hearing is getting worse and probably both :wink:

Yeh tongue in cheek about investing too.
Just like to invest time lately into exploring future tech and what soon could be.

Im still scratching my forehead though.
With the link i posted, there are lots of eminent, highly respected scientists at a meeting.
They all say they are excited, they have had working experiments and there is one in the building.
They say they're experiments all produce energy way above chemical, they dont really know what it is yet, so this discovery is amazing, right, what am i missing :?
Has this whole section of the scientific community been brainwashed or is it about hang ups with fusion, which appeared to be a factor, which plagued it from the start.
Or is it a kinda wise men conspiracy theory, similar to global warming, eg we're not sure so its for the best anyhow.
 
Like everybody else, I hope this is real and becomes a viable energy source. The behavior pattern is just too much like a deception for me to buy their claims now. If it is a hoax, they are very good at stringing investors along.

I do believe that some form of LENR is possible and I have seen transmutation of elements in my garage, so that is possible. Being 'possible' and being practical or developed are quite different things though.

For now, just get some popcorn, sit back, and watch the show.
 
Yeh best slow down and watch the show,
I want my reactor on my bike and now or i'll :cry: :cry: :lol:

Did you make one :shock: and manage to turn tinned connectors into gold
or, thinking Big Bang, making a goldfish glow in the dark :D.
 
fechter said:
...and I have seen transmutation of elements in my garage, so that is possible.

Let me guess-- "stuff" transformed into "old junk"?

For what it's worth, rust is not an element.
 
Chalo said:
fechter said:
...and I have seen transmutation of elements in my garage, so that is possible.

Let me guess-- "stuff" transformed into "old junk"?

For what it's worth, rust is not an element.
:lol:

Now if anyone could stop that carbon magically appearing on my controller boards :?:
 
I'm an expert at transmuting perfectly good silicon into carbon :wink:

Actually, this experiment is well documented. If you take a pair of pure carbon (graphite) rods and set them up with a power supply so you can draw an arc (like a scaled down arc welder), iron particles will be produced. Using a Neodynium magnet, you can collect enough of the iron particles to see. The fact the particles are attracted to the magnet indicates they contain iron. There is no iron in the graphite rods.

While maybe of no practical use, the experiment demonstrates transmutation is possible under garage conditions.
 
It seems so extremely unlikely to turn carbon into iron. Are you sure it's not just making one of the magnetically attracted states of carbon?
 
Let me clarify the "good article" statement I made above: Good as to describe what was referenced... I don't see it happening physically however. IIRC Fe is one of the, or the most stable nucleus, but I don't see how you get from C to Fe with just a wee little arc.
 
Fe is the heaviest of the elements you get energy output from the creation of, at least with fusion (like in a star). You have to add energy to fuse atoms to get heavier elements.

I don't know how much energy you would get out of the fusion, but there should be detectable radiation, probably of several varieties, if the plasma arc was indeed causing nuclear fusion to generate FE from C (or other elements).

I don't remember the details, but I recall an article about creating magnetic carbon using proton irradiation. I expect that in a plasma arc, you might have electrons floating around, and maybe if hydrogen was trapped in that arc (in water vapor form air?) it would then have free protons, though I don't know if it would be at the right energy state to do whatever is needed to make magnetic carbon.

I suspect that in the extreme environment of a plasma arc (depending on how hot it was), you could get a lot of exotic conditions, including at least temporary magnetic domains in materials that otherwise do not ever have them. With electrons being stripped away entirely from nuclei, tehn when they re-integrate some of the stuff probably doesn't act "normal" at least at first.
 
Just read a paper from 2011 on C60 atom research. They produce it by arcing ultra pure carbon in a near vacuum.

There is no iron being made from a carbon arc, the particles you find that are magnetic are C60 atoms (which are very cool stuff!).

C60 atoms are made naturally in nature by lightning strikes, and by humans using early carbon arc lamps. They were just considdered as dirty soot mess until deeper research showed the carbon was in some amazing forms.
 
Making buckyball sounds more reasonable than making iron. And more fun. I think C60 would make a decent dry lube.

I spent a few hours looking up info on this during a rather dull confrence call today. I couldn't get hard numbers on the radiation released but you would likely glow in the dark for the few minutes left of your life if you could produce a gram of iron from carbon. Too many protons would escape. You would also likely have to form Magnesium(12) and a few other elements along with the iron (Argon(18), chromium(24) ). It would be easy to test for the Magnesium. Just drop the residue in water and see if it explodes.

What I read on carbon Makes LFP's theory sound more reasonable. Various Carbon Fullerenes and nanotubes can be produced in electical arcing. Some of them are magnetic.
 
Drunkskunk said:
Making buckyball sounds more reasonable than making iron. And more fun. I think C60 would make a decent dry lube.

I spent a few hours looking up info on this during a rather dull confrence call today. I couldn't get hard numbers on the radiation released but you would likely glow in the dark for the few minutes left of your life if you could produce a gram of iron from carbon. Too many protons would escape. You would also likely have to form Magnesium(12) and a few other elements along with the iron (Argon(18), chromium(24) ). It would be easy to test for the Magnesium. Just drop the residue in water and see if it explodes.

What I read on carbon Makes LFP's theory sound more reasonable. Various Carbon Fullerenes and nanotubes can be produced in electical arcing. Some of them are magnetic.

Magnesium doesn't explode in water my friend. :) The wheels on my racecar and my old chainsaw case are made of forged magnesium alloy.

For that matter, pure Lithium metal doesn't explode in water at all, it just kinda disappointingly fizzles Hydrogen slowly.
Pure Sodium metal does substantially more in water, but it still is a disappointment and rarely does more than fizzle hydrogen unless you've got a good ignition source provided for the hydrogen.
Pure Potassium metal does make a decent showing in water, tends to make little pops and flashes, never could get a decent bang from it though, but the flashes are fun.


The famous UK TV science show that showed someone dropping various heavier Alkali metals into water with large explosions as results FAKED the videos and used dynamite and various special effect BS. All just another of the millions of reason I don't watch TV or trust anything from TV.
 
In high school we used to have a class (I don't know if they still do it today) where the teacher dropped a little piece of several of those materials in water inside a lab glass jar. I think it was Potassium that made the biggest show, including floating around the water powered by sparks and gas releases, until it crashed against the glass jar and cracked it. Unfortunately the jar cracked but didn't broke and nobody got wet, otherwise it would have been much more fun :mrgreen:
 
My old high school physics teacher made a big batch of nitrogen triiodide and let it dry out on a piece of paper towel. Unknowing lab assistant accidently placed a large beaker on top of the paper and KA-BOOM! + miniature purple mushroom cloud. Little pieces of it flew all over the room and would snap loudly when you stepped on them. Luckily nobody got hurt, but it was quite impressive - and messy.

This is the same guy that would charge up a capacitor about the size of a small refrigerator and half way through the lecture (when all the jocks were falling asleep), he would demonstrate how a small piece of copper wire on the end of a long stick would turn to plasma when enough current was passed through it. Dang, I miss the good ol days. :twisted:
 
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