A different e-Zip Trailz

My Ping 36V 10A LiFePo4 pack is now tightly fitted in the Currie battery case after a morning of cutting. strippng and soldering. I'll post various photos when I get near a non-smartphone computer.

I test rode it around the block and it went like the wind... then it cut out and needed the power switch to be turned off then on again to work. This repeated several times with increasing sensativity so I presume the BMS low power cut off is telling me it needs charging.
 
CurrieLiFePO4.gif

Some pics of the process I went through to mod the Currie box for a custom built lithium cell pack from Pingbattery on eBay.

1. Drew a circuit diagram of the original setup

2. Worked out the polarity of the output prongs on the bottom of the box

3. Drew a circuit diagram for the new setup

4. Removed the fuse and all of the old wiring except for the charging socket

5. Sawed off the central pillar and the middle ledges inside the box then sanded them smooth

6. Replaced the output plug on the new charger with the output plug from the old one

7. Connected up new wires to the new battery

8. Put padding in the gaps above and beside the battery to prevent movement

9. Closed it up and checked everything with a volt meter

This all took two guys most of the morning and involved basic electrical knowledge, soldering and sawing. The tools needed included coping saw blade, pliers, wire strippers, electrical connectors, thick wire, electrical tape, micro screwdrivers and volt meter. Just your basic hobbiest kit really!

Now let's hope I won't get any more cut outs after an overnight recharge.
 
I have found that when these duct tape pack get towards the end of their Amp Hours, they get a bit touchy about starting from motionless.

You need to pedal-first a bit when they get heavily discharged, or the BMS will keep tripping on you.
 
Excellent job, post and result! It looks like you didn't even have to rewire/relocate the BMS, or any of the BMS related wiring, so everything should still be balanced (BMS wire lengths), same as the battery builder made it, is that correct? That would be good. I was thinking the BMS would have to be moved to the top end of your battery and battery case , due to the tight dimensions. Please, keep us posted on short term and long term results.

Congratulations! It will be great if everything continues to work well, as others have stated they have had good results at 36V.

I noticed one of the web sellers has a 24V and a 36 volt version (a few US dollars difference in price) of this geared motor. I wonder if there is really any difference between them? Heavier guage wiring coming out, or inside, or winding change? Dense as I am, I kept looking for a 450 watt version (as advertised here in USA, on my bike), but no, it's only when I searched for 250 watts, that I found the identical pictured geared motor. Definately some fudge factor there.
 
I think we figured it was rated 250 for 24/7 operation without overheating, and 450 for output at the sprocket even though Currie's controller gives it like 750 input.

The 3 different geared unite motors will spin at about the same rpm when give the rated voltage so when you give all three 36v, the two 24v ones will spin faster than the 36. All three are physically different so you can't swap them using the same mount, and yes the different internal construction causes them to pull a different amount of amps.
 
Vanilla ice,

Thanks for the info. Just for clarity, your'e saying the 24V MY1018Z spins 2750 rpm at 24V, drawing 13.3 amps (no load?) and the 36V MY1018Z spins the same 2750 rpm at 36V, drawing 8.9 amps (no load?), is that correct? Note that between the two, they show the same gear ratio. Refer to the two 250 watt MY1018Z models below, they both look identical to the motor in this thread. The other 2 motors, like you say (24V MY1016Z3 and 36V MY1020Z3), are completely different .

106105.gif

250W GEARED Motor - 24 Volts (Model: MY1018Z)
Motor Parts - 106105
Shipping Weight: 5.5 lbs.
MY1018Z 24 Volt, 250 Watt, 2750 RPM, 13.3 Amp, permanent-magnet motor.
• 9 tooth sprocket for #35 chain.
• 12 gauge power leads
• Gear Ratio: 79:11 (7.182)

106115.gif

350W GEARED Motor - 24 Volts (Model: MY1016Z3)
Motor Parts - 106115
Shipping Weight: 9.0 lbs.
MY1016Z3 24 Volt, 350 Watt, 3300 RPM, 19.2 Amp, permanent-magnet motor.
• 9 tooth sprocket for #35 chain.
• 12 gauge power leads.
• Gear Ratio: 88:9 (9.778)

106105.gif

250W GEARED Motor - 36 Volts (Model: MY1018Z)
Motor Parts - 106124
Shipping Weight: 5.5 lbs.
MY1018Z 36 Volt, 250 Watt, 2750 RPM, 8.9 Amp, permanent-magnet motor.
• 9 tooth sprocket for #35 chain.
• 12 gauge power leads.
• Gear Ratio: 79:11 (7.182)

106155.gif

600W GEARED Motor - 36 Volts (Model: MY1020Z3)
Motor Parts - 106155
Shipping Weight: 14.0 lbs.
MY1020Z3 36 Volt, 600 Watt, 3200 RPM, 21.4 Amp, permanent-magnet motor.
• 9 tooth sprocket for #40 and #420 chains.
• 12 gauge power leads.
• Gear Ratio: 60:9 (6.67)
 
Ah dang I forgot they even had two different 1018's, answered the wrong question. Cool so there's four geared ones. It's not no load, I think the amp rating is the the maximum the motor is able to pull at the rated voltage. One of the smart guys should be able to clear it up for us.
 
Running perfectly! - The early report on riding with the 36 volt Ping battery after a 10 hour charge.

I've only done a 3km round trip, however, the results:
- Speed is greatly improved: I estimate 35km/h+ but will test with GPS later today.
- No cut outs.
- Motor is only slighly warm although it is only 10 degrees C at the moment, heading for 24 today.
- The stock standard throttle seems to have better power graduations especially at lower levels.
- The motor's speed and the bike's top gear match nicely for a fast power assist ride.

I'll take it for a range ride and a speed test a bit later. Now I need lighting cos I want to cruise around at night on it.

Will be giving Ping positive feedback.
 
Part two of my report:

The speed is perfect - I personally don't want to go any faster!

SPEED: With this tidy battery conversion the eZip propells me to around 32-34 km/h without assistance, 35-37 with my help. At this speed I was able to tear past the lycra brigade on every occasion. I had to get some fitted sunglasses to stop my eyes watering from the wind!

RANGE I've been from Hawthorn to the CBD, then to Port Melbourne, then to the Wesgate Punt, then back to Hawthorn via Queen Victoria Market with several stops and detours on the way. So after it's first charge, i went approx. 20km before I got my first low voltage cutout and 30km before they become regular. I could have gone further if I was more gentle with the throttle at taking off. Ping's notes say to expect the amp capacity to increase 10 - 20 % after a few charging cycles so the range is likely to be around 35km with assistance and a cruising speed of 32km/h.

HEAT: The battery box got luke warm but the 1018z motor did feel hot to touch after both legs of the journey (I'm guessing the temp was around 60 - 75 C).I'm not so keen on embarking on a cooling mod so I'll just see how it goes with relatively responsible handling.

NOISE: Even though I've recently greased the internal gears, the smoothness that it brought to the sound is fading a bit. Although, it isn't any louder than it was at 24 volts, just a higher more pleasant pitch in my opinion. Anyway, I think it's good that electric bikes get noticed so that they stand out as a good alternative mode of transport.

HANDLING: The original battery box setup was 9.5kg, the new one is 3.5kg, and it's noticeable when peddling without power and lifting the bike up a few steps. The battery box doesn't rattle like it used to so potholes sound like less of a drama. It's still a heavy Kmart bike but it delivers better stability and road holding. The brakes also seem to be coping well with more speed but less weight. I think this bike handles this speed quite well. It feels like it was made to have this power to weight ratio. Before it just felt a bit slow and a bit too heavy.

I've now spent AU$700 on my car replacement machine and thanks to Ping and Kmart it's better than ebikes costing four times that much.

Any tips or questions welcome.
 
bluthermal said:
Excellent job, post and result! It looks like you didn't even have to rewire/relocate the BMS, or any of the BMS related wiring, so everything should still be balanced (BMS wire lengths), same as the battery builder made it, is that correct? That would be good. I was thinking the BMS would have to be moved to the top end of your battery and battery case , due to the tight dimensions.
Click to expand...

Yep, I thought I would have to move the BMS to the top but Ping had factored the side BMS placement into the overal 151mm width. If you placed it on top it would be less squashed but it may be tricky to cushion the top of the battery with foam as the BMS would be in the way. With potholes etc, I think vertical shocks are more important to address than horizontal ones.

With my placement and tight fit of the BMS, there is a danger it will get damaged but it's fine so far.
 
thats great news! glad it's running really well!!!

As for sunglasses... i've got some glasses from bunnings... there are 3 styles - clear, yellow, and black.

I've gone the clear glasses for like $13.00. Beat that bike shop glasses... and they wrap around your eyes and protect you from stuff flying at your face... including branches! hahaha

oh yeah too bad it couldn't protect me from a bug that flew at my mouth going at like 50km/h lol!

As for the battery... I would suggest for you to go over the cells with a single cell charger (you can get one from yesa for around $70.00). Will help balance the pack heaps and also you can see if you have any dead cells.
 
I would suggest for you to go over the cells with a single cell charger (you can get one from yesa for around $70.00). Will help balance the pack heaps and also you can see if you have any dead cells.
Click to expand...

Albie,

The battery is running fine apart from occasional cutouts on take-off. I presume this is a BMS max current issue (max rating 35 amps) or a controller issue (24 volt, 25 amp over-clocked to 36 volts). Would it be worth unwrapping the duct tape skin to put the volt meter on each cell next time I open the battery box for a check up? I hope I don't have to unsolder anything! I am thinking of investing in Cycle Analyst rather than a single cell charger at the moment.

Thanks for your protective glasses tip too!

I'm still loving the extra speed and torque from the LifePo4 enriched Currie battery box, I don't think Bridge Rd ever opens up enough to go much faster than I'm going now. Unlike your commute which takes you out of the 40km/h zones.
 
since you are only at 36v... i would suggest just getting a doc wattson power meter from powerwerx instead of opening up the battery. Cheaper than a CA and would be suitable for what you have at the moment. CA is good if your going all out later on (ie full xlyte setup with voltages higher than 60v).

I've currently got a doc wattson on my one and the only bad thing is that it isn't backlit. if you can wait for a couple of weeks... i'll be selling my doc wattson cause i'll be getting a CA from ebikes.ca for the next stage of the build.
 
so putting lets say a capacitor going from the +ve terminal to the ebike will do the trick?

hmmm might try that fecher
 
That looks close. If you could find a 50v one it might last longer.

I think the capacitor is supposed to be installed on the battery. I'm not sure how the wires come off the battery or what the connections look like. If you can solder it to the BMS directly and glue it down, that might be good. I've seen setups where the cap was spliced into the lead wires, soldered, and wrapped with heat shrink. Makes it look like a snake that just ate a rabbit.

There will be a pretty big snap when you first hook up the wires, so be ready for that.
 
albie said:
so putting lets say a capacitor going from the +ve terminal to the ebike will do the trick?
Click to expand...
Just to clarify, the cap/caps connect parallel to the battery just like you would link up a second battery pack in parallel, right?
 
Hi folks -

One of my rides is an e-Zip Mountain Trailz (the others are a Ross Mt. Whitney and a RANS Fusion). The 36v conversion looks tempting :)

A comment re capacitors: the one you guys are talking about is a 1000 microfarad. But much larger ones are available these days, and are used in high-power car sound systems (up into the kilowatts). A 1-farad supercapacitor ain't cheap, but would have 1000 times the capacity of the other one. If you're looking for more surge current, that seems like the way to go - a local car audio shop would likely have info and experience about using 'em.

- Dave, Asheville NC USA
 
davespicer said:
Hi folks -

One of my rides is an e-Zip Mountain Trailz (the others are a Ross Mt. Whitney and a RANS Fusion). The 36v conversion looks tempting :)

A comment re capacitors: the one you guys are talking about is a 1000 microfarad. But much larger ones are available these days, and are used in high-power car sound systems (up into the kilowatts). A 1-farad supercapacitor ain't cheap, but would have 1000 times the capacity of the other one. If you're looking for more surge current, that seems like the way to go - a local car audio shop would likely have info and experience about using 'em.

- Dave, Asheville NC USA
Click to expand...

those are great in theory... however they are only 12v compatible.... any large voltages = boom boom
 
We're also very comfortable with working with smaller caps too. I tried fitting 1 larger capacitor into the controller before. It just won't work out. Fitting in a bunch of smaller one is easier. On one of my controller i lop off the lid and hand the large capacitor outside and the expose electronics, wires, and explosive-likes capacitor makes the whole thing look like a bomb. I got so much looks from people that day.
 
You can hook up several of the big 12v caps in series, but I think bob or fetch said the more you link up the less capacitance you get. The ones just shy of being powerful enough for car audio use are pretty cheap. Maybe 1/8th farad or so. But yeah esier to just get a high voltage one, less wiring up.
 
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