davespicer
100 W
vanilla ice said:
Maybe something like this 16,000 uF 60V one? (US$12.50) http://www.tedss.com/specSearch.asp?cat=Capacitors&sst=%40ct_Aluminum+%3E+Large+Can+%3E+Computer+Grade%40vo_60.0%40vU_VDC&pgn=1&sor=pn&sil=n
A different e-Zip Trailz
- Thread starter Blacklisted
- Start date
Maybe something like this 16,000 uF 60V one? (US$12.50) http://www.tedss.com/specSearch.asp?cat=Capacitors&sst=%40ct_Aluminum+%3E+Large+Can+%3E+Computer+Grade%40vo_60.0%40vU_VDC&pgn=1&sor=pn&sil=n
Blacklisted
10 mW
That's huge! It's the size of a soft drink can. Anyway, I'm getting used to avoiding the current drains that I presume causes the BMS to trip.
An update on the peformance of the LiFePO4 pack; I took it for a long tour around Melbourne on the weekend and got 32km out of it, me ging 25% and the motor doing 75% of the work. Probably could have gone further but I wimped out af the first low voltage cut out because it conveniently occurred 1km from home.
The best thing about the trip was overtaking a tram on a hill! It was a very old tram.
An update on the peformance of the LiFePO4 pack; I took it for a long tour around Melbourne on the weekend and got 32km out of it, me ging 25% and the motor doing 75% of the work. Probably could have gone further but I wimped out af the first low voltage cut out because it conveniently occurred 1km from home.
The best thing about the trip was overtaking a tram on a hill! It was a very old tram.
vanilla ice
1 MW
Blacklisted said:
Like this size?
bobmcree said:
From this post- http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2200 in reference to using car audio capacitors in series.
bluthermal
1 W
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2008
- Messages
- 58
Blacklisted,
It sounds like you are mostly happy with the 36V 10Ah LiFeP04 Ping battery (I wonder how you know for sure it is LiFeP04?) combined with your stock eZip. I've been riding my stock eZip with the stock 24V SLAs, back and forth to work (about 7 miles each way, 11.25 km) for less than a week now, and they are already showing signs of weakening, despite prompt charging after each use.
So, I'm now looking for a second Currie rack mount battery case, if anyone has one cheap. I live in Mission Viejo, CA, USA 92692.
I'll probably also be ordering one or two of the custom batteries from Ping, same as what you are using, in the near future.
How is your motor holding up? It's hilly where I ride, is it hilly where you ride too?
Did you do anything to bypass the speed limiting circuitry?
Thanks for your posting.
It sounds like you are mostly happy with the 36V 10Ah LiFeP04 Ping battery (I wonder how you know for sure it is LiFeP04?) combined with your stock eZip. I've been riding my stock eZip with the stock 24V SLAs, back and forth to work (about 7 miles each way, 11.25 km) for less than a week now, and they are already showing signs of weakening, despite prompt charging after each use.
So, I'm now looking for a second Currie rack mount battery case, if anyone has one cheap. I live in Mission Viejo, CA, USA 92692.
I'll probably also be ordering one or two of the custom batteries from Ping, same as what you are using, in the near future.
How is your motor holding up? It's hilly where I ride, is it hilly where you ride too?
Did you do anything to bypass the speed limiting circuitry?
Thanks for your posting.
albie
100 W
trust me... not worth buying a pack from currie. just go straight to a lifepo4 pack (a duct tape pack will do well here).bluthermal said:Blacklisted,
It sounds like you are mostly happy with the 36V 10Ah LiFeP04 Ping battery (I wonder how you know for sure it is LiFeP04?) combined with your stock eZip. I've been riding my stock eZip with the stock 24V SLAs, back and forth to work (about 7 miles each way, 11.25 km) for less than a week now, and they are already showing signs of weakening, despite prompt charging after each use.
So, I'm now looking for a second Currie rack mount battery case, if anyone has one cheap. I live in Mission Viejo, CA, USA 92692.
I'll probably also be ordering one or two of the custom batteries from Ping, same as what you are using, in the near future.
How is your motor holding up? It's hilly where I ride, is it hilly where you ride too?
Did you do anything to bypass the speed limiting circuitry?
Thanks for your posting.
there isn't anything speed limiting on the bike. Just pretty much work off the theory that for every volt you run on the bike you get just under 1km/h. So theoretically you get 38km/h on a 38v pack... same go with 24v = 24km/h roughly.
What's really limiting on the bike is the controller (its housed in the rear rack). If you can find a suitable replacement for it to run 48v you'll be fine but trying to look for one is a headache.
bluthermal
1 W
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2008
- Messages
- 58
Albie,
You wrote: trust me... not worth buying a pack from currie.
Yeah, I'm just looking for the empty plastic case, to keep it stock looking, like blacklisted's.
And: there isn't anything speed limiting on the bike.
My bike seems to gradually drop power to the speed controller, once a certain speed (around 20mph?) is reached. Pedal only power after that, despite full throttle. Maybe it's just that the max speed of the motor has been reached? I don't know.
And: If you can find a suitable replacement for it to run 48v.
I don't think that the stock motor could handle 48V for long (could it?). I'm on a tight budget (actually, the motor is not that expensive). 48V controllers don't seem that hard to find, unless trying to exactly match the wiring, or, you want a good quality controller.
You wrote: trust me... not worth buying a pack from currie.
Yeah, I'm just looking for the empty plastic case, to keep it stock looking, like blacklisted's.
And: there isn't anything speed limiting on the bike.
My bike seems to gradually drop power to the speed controller, once a certain speed (around 20mph?) is reached. Pedal only power after that, despite full throttle. Maybe it's just that the max speed of the motor has been reached? I don't know.
And: If you can find a suitable replacement for it to run 48v.
I don't think that the stock motor could handle 48V for long (could it?). I'm on a tight budget (actually, the motor is not that expensive). 48V controllers don't seem that hard to find, unless trying to exactly match the wiring, or, you want a good quality controller.
Blacklisted
10 mW
There is no way you will go back to a 24volt SLA pack once you have 36volts LiFePO4. Just repack your existing case like I did and forget about preserving the original SLA setup.
An inspection inside my modded case after a few weeks of service found everything is safe and sound. Nothing looks or smells like it gets hot and no signs of movement or stress.
They simply perform to spec. and I've read other's experiences here on the Battery Technology forum. Buy from Ping because he obviously cares about his business reputation and that means good products and good service at a fair price.
Melbourne is moderately hilly - shouldn't be a problem if you help a bit and give the motor a break down hill.
I'm not the best person to advise you on the longevity of the motor. What I've read suggests heat is the main danger and mine hasn't gotten too hot to touch. If my skin hasn't been burnt by the heat then it's hardly going to melt the windings. I'm also happy that no electrical smells have occurred.
I've been told by an ebike dealer here to keep the drive system lubricated. At top speed, some of the noises I hear make me think that accellerated wear is taking place. The same thing is happening to the breaks, tyres and bearings on any heavy bike ridden at speed.
Blacklisted
10 mW
I have been watching ebay with interest because Ping relisted a battery with the exact same specs as the custom pack I ordered to fit my e-zip. This auction has ended and it looks like this pack might become a popular seller for him.
There were eight bids. These packs usually get only one bid. Mine cost around US$0.61 per watt. The latest one went for US$0.85 per watt. Behind all the bids there were just three unique members. Obviously someone was prepared to pay a premium. I hope it's worth it!
There were eight bids. These packs usually get only one bid. Mine cost around US$0.61 per watt. The latest one went for US$0.85 per watt. Behind all the bids there were just three unique members. Obviously someone was prepared to pay a premium. I hope it's worth it!
Blacklisted
10 mW
I'm e-bike-proud so I'm not fussed about being 'stealthy' but after a dozen rides my MY1018z is positively LOUD!
I've previously filled the gear case with grease which settled the noise down a lot - but now it's back to a slightly painful scream.
Today I opened her up for the nth time to see what was going on. All that grease had worn off the gears and was mostly clinging to the walls.
The teeth were very dry so I applied a new spread of grease to hopefully control the noise until I can find a sustainable solution.
It worked. I took it for a ride to the market 6km each way and the noise stayed within my tolerance levels.
But for how long. I have read the experimentation by Reid on this issue but not sure if they worked in the long run:
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=482&p=6746&hilit=my1018+grease#p6746
- pack gear box full of grease, drill two holes in the case so that greasing can be done without dismantling the motor.
- cement bearings to shaft (I think mine already are)
- manually align the armature to find the gear sweet spot (I think my problem would still be grease wearing off the gears)
- somewhow design a grease circulation system to keep grease flowing on the gears
However, my noise complaint is trivial in contrast to the recent run of blown controllers, broken motors and crashed bikes.
I've previously filled the gear case with grease which settled the noise down a lot - but now it's back to a slightly painful scream.
Today I opened her up for the nth time to see what was going on. All that grease had worn off the gears and was mostly clinging to the walls.
The teeth were very dry so I applied a new spread of grease to hopefully control the noise until I can find a sustainable solution.
It worked. I took it for a ride to the market 6km each way and the noise stayed within my tolerance levels.
But for how long. I have read the experimentation by Reid on this issue but not sure if they worked in the long run:
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=482&p=6746&hilit=my1018+grease#p6746
- pack gear box full of grease, drill two holes in the case so that greasing can be done without dismantling the motor.
- cement bearings to shaft (I think mine already are)
- manually align the armature to find the gear sweet spot (I think my problem would still be grease wearing off the gears)
- somewhow design a grease circulation system to keep grease flowing on the gears
However, my noise complaint is trivial in contrast to the recent run of blown controllers, broken motors and crashed bikes.
bluthermal
1 W
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2008
- Messages
- 58
Blacklisted,
Thanks for keeping up on the posts. Mine is getting loud now too. I'll be greasing mine soon too. It would be nice to come up with a longer lasting solution.
I've been riding my bike back and forth to work about 7 miles each way for two 5-day weeks now. The stock batteries are about half depleted by then (after 7 miles) and useless after that point, the hills are a pain now at the end of my commutes. I can tell how the charge has been gradually degrading, despite prompt recharging, always. So I ordered a battery from Ping last week, twice as big as yours (134mm instead of 67mm, 20ah), so it won't fit completely inside the plastic case anymore, but should still be able to slide and lock it in and out.
I carry a 15 pound pack on top of the rear rack, and the rack is bending from high speed transitions from the street up ramps onto the sidewalks, due to no rear suspension. The bend is less pronounced on the side the battery is in, but makes locking the battery in difficult. I always lock the battery now, when in use, it makes it easier to get the battery locked in, and supports the rack better. I might get another empty plastic box to lock into the other side, just to support the rack better.
Thanks for keeping up on the posts. Mine is getting loud now too. I'll be greasing mine soon too. It would be nice to come up with a longer lasting solution.
I've been riding my bike back and forth to work about 7 miles each way for two 5-day weeks now. The stock batteries are about half depleted by then (after 7 miles) and useless after that point, the hills are a pain now at the end of my commutes. I can tell how the charge has been gradually degrading, despite prompt recharging, always. So I ordered a battery from Ping last week, twice as big as yours (134mm instead of 67mm, 20ah), so it won't fit completely inside the plastic case anymore, but should still be able to slide and lock it in and out.
I carry a 15 pound pack on top of the rear rack, and the rack is bending from high speed transitions from the street up ramps onto the sidewalks, due to no rear suspension. The bend is less pronounced on the side the battery is in, but makes locking the battery in difficult. I always lock the battery now, when in use, it makes it easier to get the battery locked in, and supports the rack better. I might get another empty plastic box to lock into the other side, just to support the rack better.
kbarrett
10 kW
Blacklisted said:
Drill and tap one 1/4"-28 hole near the bottom of your gear case and screw a "zerk" fitting into it. Drill a small ( maybe 1/16" ) hole near the top on the side so it doesn't suck in rain water.
Use a standard automotive grease gun to fill it.
( edit: not certain what the metric equivalents are, but you get the idea ... )
Blacklisted
10 mW
Similar to Reid's approach which is worth reproducing here:
For the cheap curries with their Unite 1018 motors,
the bike will go 24mph by just upping the volts to 36.
The stock controller will still serve, won't blow (mine hasn't, anyway).
The motor -will require- forced air cooling though.
And I am greatly convinced by vast experience (ha ha) of having ruined one motor, and then by keeping its replacement alive ever since,
it's well-worthwhile to cement the motor bearings to their shafts (banish journal slip-fits) And I lightly 'glue' (PerfectGlue, rubbery stuff) the bearigs' OD's to the bores. This stops odd squeals and makes the gear meshings solid, unchanging. My second motor runs relatively silently under load. It's surprisingly quiet. The gear mesh is adjustble to a degree, owing to slop-fit of the case covers. Make book of that by trial running the motor without load, on a few volts, whilst fiddling the covers;
then lock them down. Seal the case joins with a smear of something or other; otherwise water will work in. Make the grease compartment re-greaseable by two 8/32 tapped holes; syringe-in a supply of moly bearing grease (my fave for this), and plug the grease-in-grease-out holes with stubby screws.
I like a 45 dollar motor that, when it fails or gets old, can be swapped in just a few minutes of time. Run within its design center of 15mph/250W, I daresay it's "efficient" as anything else, for practical purposes.
Yet, for pushing hard, it will go inefficient, converting many amps into toaster heat. But that's a price I'll pay to have a five pound motor system capable of driving my cheap bike 24 or more mph. I will make it to thirty some day with this thing. Need more volts, is all. And more force cooling.
bluthermal
1 W
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2008
- Messages
- 58
Yes, like Blacklisted and Reid suggest:
I made my first 7mile ride in and 7 back to work yesterday with my new Ping lifepo4 36V (45V when fully charged, 39V after 7miles) 20ah battery. I see now it will be challenging to get the range I wanted, since I'm using so much more power now for speed and addtional climbing power. What a huge difference! Next , I can see the need to make adjustments to keep from toasting my motor (none made yet). The motor gets real warm now.
I think I read it somewhere before, but does anyone know what voltage the Ping BMS starts to kick in at, for low voltage protection?
I made my first 7mile ride in and 7 back to work yesterday with my new Ping lifepo4 36V (45V when fully charged, 39V after 7miles) 20ah battery. I see now it will be challenging to get the range I wanted, since I'm using so much more power now for speed and addtional climbing power. What a huge difference! Next , I can see the need to make adjustments to keep from toasting my motor (none made yet). The motor gets real warm now.
I think I read it somewhere before, but does anyone know what voltage the Ping BMS starts to kick in at, for low voltage protection?
kbarrett
10 kW
My ping pack starts getting freaky around 33-32V or so.
It will run, but put the slightest load on it and the BMS resets at that low a voltage.
It will run, but put the slightest load on it and the BMS resets at that low a voltage.
Blacklisted
10 mW
On the whole, I'm really liking my PingZip.
However, I've been working on a way to easily keep it lubricated so it won't scream too loud. Taking the motor off and the gearbox apart every couple of weeks to apply grease was clearly unsustainable.
The plan was to loosely follow the advice in the previous posts. I got some grease and grease nipples from an auto garage and a grease gun off eBay, all up about $30. With my electric drill, hole punch and some spare nuts and bolts I have installed the grease nipple to spurt grease directly onto the big gear cog whenever it may need it. I've also drilled another whole, plugged with a small bolt, to release excess grease pressure as needed.
It's still early days, but after about four small pumps of the handle the noise is OK but not as quiet as it was when I would take it apart and grease the gears by hand. I even made sure the motor was rotating to evenly spread the grease while I was pumping it in.
While the noise outcome is mediocre, the good news from inside the motor was that there were no visible signs of heat damage after running it at 36v for at least a month. Some grease looks like it has gotten into the motor and flung in between the magnets but I don't think it is enough to worry about - I previously had loads of grease in the gears so I'm not surprised.
However, I've been working on a way to easily keep it lubricated so it won't scream too loud. Taking the motor off and the gearbox apart every couple of weeks to apply grease was clearly unsustainable.
The plan was to loosely follow the advice in the previous posts. I got some grease and grease nipples from an auto garage and a grease gun off eBay, all up about $30. With my electric drill, hole punch and some spare nuts and bolts I have installed the grease nipple to spurt grease directly onto the big gear cog whenever it may need it. I've also drilled another whole, plugged with a small bolt, to release excess grease pressure as needed.
It's still early days, but after about four small pumps of the handle the noise is OK but not as quiet as it was when I would take it apart and grease the gears by hand. I even made sure the motor was rotating to evenly spread the grease while I was pumping it in.
While the noise outcome is mediocre, the good news from inside the motor was that there were no visible signs of heat damage after running it at 36v for at least a month. Some grease looks like it has gotten into the motor and flung in between the magnets but I don't think it is enough to worry about - I previously had loads of grease in the gears so I'm not surprised.
ngocthach1130
1 kW
use automatic transmission fluid together with the grease. The grease is pretty thick so it doesn't distribute well in there. have just enough ATF in there so it pool up where the bottom of the bigger spur gear just touch it. It would pick it up and distribute it all around. Much less noise with the ATF.
Blacklisted
10 mW
Would oil have the same effect? I don't have any ATF laying around.
kbarrett
10 kW
Blacklisted said:
ATF = SAE20 + detergent
Blacklisted
10 mW
kbarrett said:
Is that 'yes', 'no' or a chemical recipe?
:?
kbarrett
10 kW
Blacklisted said:
Sorry ... didn't realize I was being obtuse.
ATF fluid is simply SAE 20 weight light automotive oil with a lot of detergent additives to keep gunk from building up in transmissions.
If you can find any oil that is 20 weight cold ( look at the first number ), it will do the job. I suspect cheap-assed 30 weight will work fine as well.
bluthermal
1 W
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2008
- Messages
- 58
Today I burned up my 24V stock motor (running now for one week with Ping lifepo4 36V 20AH). With all the hills in my area, I don't have it in me to treat the motor right (and keep from burning it up, while rushing off to work).
It was great having all the extra speed and power, and I will miss them a lot. However, I need cheap and reliable. So, I have ordered the 36V version of the Unite 250W geared motor as a replacement (to better match my expensive battery) for now.
After initially breaking in the battery, I had just started to test the range. I was up to 21 miles total distance (to, from, and back to work the next day) on my last (powered) ride when the motor burned up on the last hill going to work. After 7 miles, the voltage was around 39.8V, after 14 miles, around 39.5V, after 21miles, around 39.2V. So it looks like I may be able to make the 30 mile range I was looking for, after all.
Has anyone else used the 36V version of the Unite 250W geared motor? If yes, how did it work out for you?
Also, I tried running 30 weight lubricant, similar to what was suggested with the auto trans fluid previously. My guess is that no one else actually has done this. It did not work out right for me. It's not a sealed area for the oil to settle in, and the oil ends up finding it's way out, one path or another. The best I could work out was a gravity/vibration feed drip system, but that was messy too.
It was great having all the extra speed and power, and I will miss them a lot. However, I need cheap and reliable. So, I have ordered the 36V version of the Unite 250W geared motor as a replacement (to better match my expensive battery) for now.
After initially breaking in the battery, I had just started to test the range. I was up to 21 miles total distance (to, from, and back to work the next day) on my last (powered) ride when the motor burned up on the last hill going to work. After 7 miles, the voltage was around 39.8V, after 14 miles, around 39.5V, after 21miles, around 39.2V. So it looks like I may be able to make the 30 mile range I was looking for, after all.
Has anyone else used the 36V version of the Unite 250W geared motor? If yes, how did it work out for you?
Also, I tried running 30 weight lubricant, similar to what was suggested with the auto trans fluid previously. My guess is that no one else actually has done this. It did not work out right for me. It's not a sealed area for the oil to settle in, and the oil ends up finding it's way out, one path or another. The best I could work out was a gravity/vibration feed drip system, but that was messy too.
TylerDurden
100 GW
I have not tried the 36V, but I'd still bust-out the drill.bluthermal said:
http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2163&p=28218#p28218
kbarrett
10 kW
bluthermal said:
Not surprised. I'd use a zerk fitting and stick to grease. It shouldn't take much to quiet the gears.
vanilla ice
1 MW
You can get sheets of gasket material from napa auto. If that would even help. I'm not sure where the leaking was happening. Its pretty simple to trace out the shapes you need with a pencil and go at it with the scissors. Fun even!
bluthermal
1 W
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2008
- Messages
- 58
As best I could tell, the paper gasket between the gear drive housing and the motor was not a problem when intact (at least comparatively). I think the majority of oil leakage was through the bearing area of the motor drive shaft, and into the motor itself. I'm not sure how one would seal that area better. Even the thick grease migrates through there.
