Adventures On The Cheap
- Thread starter Raketemensch
- Start date
Raketemensch
10 W
elias said:
Wow, 60, that thing must haul.
If you get a chance, could you measure how wide it is?
RunForTheHills
1 kW
Raketemensch said:
I don't have any experience with putting an eight speed freewheel on a hub motor. Grin sells a spacer for the purpose though.
https://www.ebikes.ca/shop/electric-bicycle-parts/motor-hardware/washers-and-spacers/spacewash3.html
Raketemensch
10 W
RunForTheHills said:
Dang, I was looking forward to giving Grin money, but $15 to ship a $4 spacer isn't awesome
What's the worst that could happen if I used a washer with a round hole in the middle?
RunForTheHills
1 kW
Raketemensch said:Dang, I was looking forward to giving Grin money, but $15 to ship a $4 spacer isn't awesome
What's the worst that could happen if I used a washer with a round hole in the middle?
I am sure you could fabricate something. I think a round inside hole wouldn't matter. The outside diameter of the washer has to be small enough to fit in the opening of the freewheel. Grin also sells the freewheel you want, so you could order both from them and combine shipping.
https://www.ebikes.ca/shop/electric-bicycle-parts/freewheels/fw8spd1132.html
Or you could go the eBay route:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Electric-b...m33fddc20aa:g:zRIAAOSwxrJcJrvr&frcectupt=true
motomech
10 MW
The DNP 11-32 is the correct free whl. for this install. Since you will only be using 2 or 3 gears once the you start getting some time riding w/ the motor, you could even use the 7 gear DNP. Either way, there is no reason they won't fit. It's a fairly common install. That motor is not particualy wide and w/ an 8 gear free whl. should drop right into a 130 m/m drop-out width. If a spacer is needed between the free whl. and the drop-out to prevent rubbing, sometimes a plain flat washer (or two) from the hardware store is all that is needed, but if you order the free whl. from Grim, you might as well get their spacer.
As always w/ a hub motor, the axel needs to be well secured w/ torque arm(s). One, well fitted TA might suffice, but two would be better.
As always w/ a hub motor, the axel needs to be well secured w/ torque arm(s). One, well fitted TA might suffice, but two would be better.
You need a different tool for the lock ring on the cassette and the freewheel. Also, make sure the freewheel tool has a large enough hole to fit over the axle on your hub motor (some are made for quick releases and not large enough).
Raketemensch
10 W
As always, a huge thank you to all of you for the help. This place is awesome because of people like you.
motomech
10 MW
What is your Torque Arm set-up now? I don't see one in the pics. Surely you weren't riding it w/out one?
What style torque arm do you have now? Was it a genaric supplied in the motor kit?
Before you do anything else, I would mock-up two TA's, which because of the shallowness of your drop-outs (and perhaps the quality of the metal), I would do both sides. If you could get an idea of how the TA's are going to fit, you could know if you are going to need one of the special shaped TA's Grin sells (V2, V3, V4) and order everything from them in one shot to save on shipping. The TA's from Grin are pricey, but sometimes nothing else will work short of making your own.
What style torque arm do you have now? Was it a genaric supplied in the motor kit?
Before you do anything else, I would mock-up two TA's, which because of the shallowness of your drop-outs (and perhaps the quality of the metal), I would do both sides. If you could get an idea of how the TA's are going to fit, you could know if you are going to need one of the special shaped TA's Grin sells (V2, V3, V4) and order everything from them in one shot to save on shipping. The TA's from Grin are pricey, but sometimes nothing else will work short of making your own.
Raketemensch
10 W
elias said:That 60 T wheel has around 245mm diameter.
BTW: raketemensch - meaning "man like a rocket" or something like that? That would be "Raketenmensch" in german. Sorry, but I teach that language
Awesome, thank you for doing that for me!
And I know, it sucks, it's a reference to the character in Pynchon's "Gravity's Rainbow," in which it's also incorrect :] He yells, "Fickt nicht mit dem Raketemensch!"
Raketemensch said:
Well I immediately thought that I have to read that, but after reading this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravity's_Rainbow#Plot, I'm not so sure about this any more?!? Sounds weird.
I quote: "Slothrop meets members of the Schwarzkommando, a fictional cadre of African rocket technicians, descended from survivors of the Herero genocide of 1904 who were brought to Europe by German colonials" WTF!?!? :lol:
Working on this book included the consumation of certain mushrooms I suppose...
There was and still is a certain fascination in the anglo-saxon world about the german language, Nazi-Germany or related stuff, I know that, but to a modern citizen of the country it is sometimes quite funny what english or american authors made out of it
This topic is very amusingly covered in Fintan O'Toole's "Heroic Failure; Brexit and the Politics of Pain", a fun read btw.
Depends.2old said:
The Park FR-(somethingorothernumber) tool I have here works on both the cassettes I have (at least two of them, the only ones I've had to deal with) and the Shimano-spline-freewheels I've got, of various brands I can't remember.
I think this is the one I have
https://www.parktool.com/product/freewheel-remover-fr-1-3?category=Cassette%20%26%20Freewheel
Raketemensch
10 W
motomech said:
I finally have one on there now. Another is coming in the mail, I wanted to make sure it would fit well before ordering two. It also came with an extra spacer, which should work well if I need one with this freewheel, assuming it ever arrives. The USPS seems to have lost it, which really sucks.
elias said:Well I immediately thought that I have to read that, but after reading this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravity's_Rainbow#Plot, I'm not so sure about this any more?!? Sounds weird.
I quote: "Slothrop meets members of the Schwarzkommando, a fictional cadre of African rocket technicians, descended from survivors of the Herero genocide of 1904 who were brought to Europe by German colonials" WTF!?!? :lol:
Working on this book included the consumation of certain mushrooms I suppose...
There was and still is a certain fascination in the anglo-saxon world about the german language, Nazi-Germany or related stuff, I know that, but to a modern citizen of the country it is sometimes quite funny what english or american authors made out of it
This topic is very amusingly covered in Fintan O'Toole's "Heroic Failure; Brexit and the Politics of Pain", a fun read btw.
It is a great book, it's one of the best works of absurdism in western literature IMHO. Not an easy read, but definitely worth it. My ancestors were German, so I've learned just enough of the language to sound like an idiot.
I have some MT60 connectors coming today, which I'll use to replace that terminal block, and the tail rack has arrived, so I'm going to move the controller to that. I was thinking about under-mounting it, but I don't want the back tire throwing water, mud etc. at it all the time, so it'll end up on top for now. I might 3d print something to mount it on the arm between the rack and the seatpost.
I also got a bar-end mirror for the left side, which got good (real) reviews:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0009R96YK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I'm not sure if I have enough wire to get from the battery to the controller if I move it yet, so I'm going to pick up some more wire to do that. I'll have to google what gauge I should use. Since the battery is removable from the bike, I can either put some XT60s on there (i have a bunch of them around from building drones) or just keep the andersons -- it's not a big deal either way because those connections stay in place 99% of the time.
It's been an insane week -- tons of family stuff and parties and sleepovers, so I'm just too tired to work on it today. Not having the freewheel is also a little disappointing, which is slowing me down. This is the 3rd package the USPS has just straight-up lost on me in the past year.
Raketemensch
10 W
Last week I went out and had some Adventures in Range Anxiety.
There's a really cool town about 25 miles away, over the border into MA, so I wanted to see if I could make it there and back. I've done a couple of 20-mile rides and come back with over half the battery, at least according to my cheap hand throttle. I probably should check with a voltmeter, but just haven't. The roads, as I've mentioned earlier, are truly horrible. There are some potholes that are 2-3 inches deep, which is what made me switch to full-suspension. It's made a massive difference for me.
Anyway, it was a beautiful ride, on a beautiful day, and as I was hitting the 20-mile mark (about 5 miles short of my goal) it hit me how much coasting I'd done, at some nice high speeds, for the last 15 minutes or so -- which meant I'd have to get back up those hills. So even if I was still at half battery, a) I don't trust my "meter," and b) flying drones has taught me that the bottom half of a lipo can be very different from the top half, so I turned around and headed home, thinking I would see if I maybe still had another 5 miles or so left in it when I got there.
I pedal constantly, and am always trying to get into better shape while also maximizing the battery life. It's 13ah, so I should be able to get some good distance out of it if I work at it.
So I made it up a bunch of long, not-too-steep grades early on, and at one point actually got off and walked it up one grade that was probably a mile long, just to be on the safe side. The green light was long gone, and the yellow "half" light was starting to go out on some of the climbs, but I knew the next 15 miles had a lot of down hills, so I should be alright. I got past the last of the big climbs going pretty well, and made it to the beginning of the nice downhill runs, which felt awesome. I can break 40mph on some of these hills without using the motor at all, so one day they'll be great for regen, which should get me even more distance.
So I'm hauling ass down this one hill and spot a big pothole, so I set up for a little bunny hop, but I'm old now and really moving and I think that when my weight was fully on downforce just before jumping, I hit the pothole. I felt it hard throughout the bike, heard the battery click against the frame, heard a few other loud noises I couldn't identify, but kept cruising down the rest of the hill and stopped at the bottom to make sure everything was intact, and discovered a pinch flat. With 10 miles still to go.
Now, I'm just getting started with biking again, so I didn't have any spares or even a toolkit with me. Not a huge deal, though, because I managed to stop on the ONE tiny stretch of road where I still have cell signal, so I called my wife to come pick me up -- except she's shopping several towns away, with more stores to hit, so I started walking the bike home. Gorgeous day, it was actually really nice to see everything at even slower speeds than on the bike, spotting old foundations and bridges and whatnot in the woods, checking out some 250 year old houses, etc.
I walked the bike 6 miles before my wife could pick me up. Lost 2 pounds that day :]
It was the cheap-ass default tire that came with the hub kit, but I just needed it to get me through that one weekend, as I'm getting a pair of Maxxis Hookworms for Father's Day tomorrow. I picked up some Kenda Downhill tubes as well.
As I was pulling the old tire off this morning I discovered that they had actually installed a 29-inch tube in the 26-inch rim, and just folded it over near the valve. I could see where the green slime had oozed out of the seams right near the fold.
So it was a bummer, but this morning I pulled the cheap 6-speed freewheel off the hub and installed the 8-speed that arrived yesterday. I was hoping to move the controller to the tail rack, but I don't have enough battery wire to make it that far. I also am going to install the MT60s on the phase wires from the motor so I can stop having to tear apart a terminal block every time I need to pull the rear wheel.
The new freewheel is an 11t, which should allow me to attain a higher average speed. I'm at 16mph now, and hoping to push more toward 20. The front gear is only 42t, and I want to bump it to at least 48t if not higher, but I have to replace the whole crankset so that'll wait until later in the summer because I've been nickel-and-diming a lot of projects on this thing lately. There should be room on the chainstay for well into the 50s, which should allow me to pedal along at quite a clip.
I can't wait to get this thing back on the road, the weather is perfect right now, but I'm waiting for tomorrow to unwrap the tires, and it'll be raining all day. Good day for wrenching, though, right?
There's a really cool town about 25 miles away, over the border into MA, so I wanted to see if I could make it there and back. I've done a couple of 20-mile rides and come back with over half the battery, at least according to my cheap hand throttle. I probably should check with a voltmeter, but just haven't. The roads, as I've mentioned earlier, are truly horrible. There are some potholes that are 2-3 inches deep, which is what made me switch to full-suspension. It's made a massive difference for me.
Anyway, it was a beautiful ride, on a beautiful day, and as I was hitting the 20-mile mark (about 5 miles short of my goal) it hit me how much coasting I'd done, at some nice high speeds, for the last 15 minutes or so -- which meant I'd have to get back up those hills. So even if I was still at half battery, a) I don't trust my "meter," and b) flying drones has taught me that the bottom half of a lipo can be very different from the top half, so I turned around and headed home, thinking I would see if I maybe still had another 5 miles or so left in it when I got there.
I pedal constantly, and am always trying to get into better shape while also maximizing the battery life. It's 13ah, so I should be able to get some good distance out of it if I work at it.
So I made it up a bunch of long, not-too-steep grades early on, and at one point actually got off and walked it up one grade that was probably a mile long, just to be on the safe side. The green light was long gone, and the yellow "half" light was starting to go out on some of the climbs, but I knew the next 15 miles had a lot of down hills, so I should be alright. I got past the last of the big climbs going pretty well, and made it to the beginning of the nice downhill runs, which felt awesome. I can break 40mph on some of these hills without using the motor at all, so one day they'll be great for regen, which should get me even more distance.
So I'm hauling ass down this one hill and spot a big pothole, so I set up for a little bunny hop, but I'm old now and really moving and I think that when my weight was fully on downforce just before jumping, I hit the pothole. I felt it hard throughout the bike, heard the battery click against the frame, heard a few other loud noises I couldn't identify, but kept cruising down the rest of the hill and stopped at the bottom to make sure everything was intact, and discovered a pinch flat. With 10 miles still to go.
Now, I'm just getting started with biking again, so I didn't have any spares or even a toolkit with me. Not a huge deal, though, because I managed to stop on the ONE tiny stretch of road where I still have cell signal, so I called my wife to come pick me up -- except she's shopping several towns away, with more stores to hit, so I started walking the bike home. Gorgeous day, it was actually really nice to see everything at even slower speeds than on the bike, spotting old foundations and bridges and whatnot in the woods, checking out some 250 year old houses, etc.
I walked the bike 6 miles before my wife could pick me up. Lost 2 pounds that day :]
It was the cheap-ass default tire that came with the hub kit, but I just needed it to get me through that one weekend, as I'm getting a pair of Maxxis Hookworms for Father's Day tomorrow. I picked up some Kenda Downhill tubes as well.
As I was pulling the old tire off this morning I discovered that they had actually installed a 29-inch tube in the 26-inch rim, and just folded it over near the valve. I could see where the green slime had oozed out of the seams right near the fold.
So it was a bummer, but this morning I pulled the cheap 6-speed freewheel off the hub and installed the 8-speed that arrived yesterday. I was hoping to move the controller to the tail rack, but I don't have enough battery wire to make it that far. I also am going to install the MT60s on the phase wires from the motor so I can stop having to tear apart a terminal block every time I need to pull the rear wheel.
The new freewheel is an 11t, which should allow me to attain a higher average speed. I'm at 16mph now, and hoping to push more toward 20. The front gear is only 42t, and I want to bump it to at least 48t if not higher, but I have to replace the whole crankset so that'll wait until later in the summer because I've been nickel-and-diming a lot of projects on this thing lately. There should be room on the chainstay for well into the 50s, which should allow me to pedal along at quite a clip.
I can't wait to get this thing back on the road, the weather is perfect right now, but I'm waiting for tomorrow to unwrap the tires, and it'll be raining all day. Good day for wrenching, though, right?
thundercamel
10 kW
Nice build thread. It's a fun read
Your kit looks the same as what I used for my wife's bike. The two pin red and black is full battery voltage whenever the controller is switched on. I use it to power lights. I still have yet to figure out what the four pin can be used for, but I'm guessing a display of some sort.
Both of our bikes have a top gear of 48t chainring to 11t freewheel now. I'd like to get a 60t chainring for my bike, but I'm not sure if I'd lose the use of my front derailleur or not. I'd like to keep it functional in case I run the battery dead, which I've done here and there testing the limits.
Your kit looks the same as what I used for my wife's bike. The two pin red and black is full battery voltage whenever the controller is switched on. I use it to power lights. I still have yet to figure out what the four pin can be used for, but I'm guessing a display of some sort.
Both of our bikes have a top gear of 48t chainring to 11t freewheel now. I'd like to get a 60t chainring for my bike, but I'm not sure if I'd lose the use of my front derailleur or not. I'd like to keep it functional in case I run the battery dead, which I've done here and there testing the limits.
Raketemensch
10 W
thundercamel said:Nice build thread. It's a fun read
Your kit looks the same as what I used for my wife's bike. The two pin red and black is full battery voltage whenever the controller is switched on. I use it to power lights. I still have yet to figure out what the four pin can be used for, but I'm guessing a display of some sort.
Both of our bikes have a top gear of 48t chainring to 11t freewheel now. I'd like to get a 60t chainring for my bike, but I'm not sure if I'd lose the use of my front derailleur or not. I'd like to keep it functional in case I run the battery dead, which I've done here and there testing the limits.
Do you know what your average speed is with 48/11? I don't have any sort of display from the ebike components, but I run Strava on the phone, which is free and awesome for tracking that kind of stuff.
2old said:
Thanks, I just started learning about those. We should call them Fatrings.
thundercamel
10 kW
My bike uses 700x38c tires. On my recent "speed run" commuting to work, my GPS track shows the long sections that I was pedaling was 26-27mph. According to the online gear calculator, my cadence must be 75rpm, and I certainly don't feel like pedaling any faster. That would be 25mph on a 26x2.0" tire.Raketemensch said:
Raketemensch
10 W
I’ve been on the west coast visiting friends and family for 2 weeks, and I will be getting home on Wednesday. The spacers I’d ordered to get the freewheel working will be waiting, as will the wires that will let me move the controller to the rear rack.
The bike is all disassembled, just waiting for me to get home and start wrenching. I mounted up the hookworms before I left, and spent too much time at various hardware stores trying to find washers to use as spacers, with no luck. So I ordered his little kit:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bike-ebike-bicycle-axle-M12-spacer-ID-12mm-set-Alum-x-7pcs/272114749114?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649
The two things I’m still missing are regen braking, and I’ve been dreaming of a quieter motor. So a new controller with regen and sine wave would be nice. In digging around, I found this, which seems too good to be true:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32960830881.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.4d033c00kUyDJu
It’s an 18fet/1500watt sinewave controller with regen for $34.
It also says it has cruse control, but has no mention of a display connector, or really any way that I can see for triggering cruise control... [edit] it looks like cruise control kicks in automatically if you have it enabled.
The bike is all disassembled, just waiting for me to get home and start wrenching. I mounted up the hookworms before I left, and spent too much time at various hardware stores trying to find washers to use as spacers, with no luck. So I ordered his little kit:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bike-ebike-bicycle-axle-M12-spacer-ID-12mm-set-Alum-x-7pcs/272114749114?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649
The two things I’m still missing are regen braking, and I’ve been dreaming of a quieter motor. So a new controller with regen and sine wave would be nice. In digging around, I found this, which seems too good to be true:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32960830881.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.4d033c00kUyDJu
It’s an 18fet/1500watt sinewave controller with regen for $34.
It also says it has cruse control, but has no mention of a display connector, or really any way that I can see for triggering cruise control... [edit] it looks like cruise control kicks in automatically if you have it enabled.
thundercamel
10 kW
Em3ev controllers show separate pins for their cruise input. That controller only shows 3 pins for their "turn the" input, lol.
Raketemensch
10 W
Woke up at 4 this morning to spend 2.5 hours sitting on a plane today before it finally took off for a 5.5-hour flight.
Landed, and drove around Jersey for an hour picking up the dog at a friend’s house, then another 2.5 hours to get home.
Dragged my ass out to the mailbox to grab the spacers before passing out — turns out they’re too small to fit over the axle.
Oy.
Landed, and drove around Jersey for an hour picking up the dog at a friend’s house, then another 2.5 hours to get home.
Dragged my ass out to the mailbox to grab the spacers before passing out — turns out they’re too small to fit over the axle.
Oy.
Raketemensch
10 W
Well, every spacer that I’ve seen for sale is 12mm, so maybe this particular hub has a fatter axle, as it straight-up won’t fit over the threads.
Raketemensch said:
12 mm is the diameter of a bicycle axle. ebike axles are usually 14 mm with 12 mm flats to fit in the dropout. the spacers you got aren't suitable anyway, since they're aluminum.
You need these:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00SCHA1ZM/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
