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D's RC Drive Kona DC1
- Thread starter deecanio
- Start date
i thought 60 was pretty good!!
FWIW:
Shorter cranks make higher cadences easier - it's not so much the RPM per se, as it is "foot speed". You can only move your feet so quickly - so if you reduce the crank length, you reduce the circumference, you reduce the speed your feet are moving to make a given cadence. I run 142mm cranks on my 'bent, and I can do ~145 rpm for short bursts, which gets me to 30 mph in the middle ring, human power only. I'm *not* a superior athlete. When I was riding fixed, I could manage ~33 mph downhill, which for that bike (geared for hills), meant ~165 rpm "assisted" cadence on 165mm cranks. (Assisted in the sense that if you don't keep up the bike will buck you right off.)
You can easily find BMX cranks with 140mm on up to 175mm cranks. They will come in 110 BCD, so will use "generic" MTB rings. Try 155's first, you might like them. If not, they're cheap and you can always move them on ebay or craigslist.
Just a thought,
John
Shorter cranks make higher cadences easier - it's not so much the RPM per se, as it is "foot speed". You can only move your feet so quickly - so if you reduce the crank length, you reduce the circumference, you reduce the speed your feet are moving to make a given cadence. I run 142mm cranks on my 'bent, and I can do ~145 rpm for short bursts, which gets me to 30 mph in the middle ring, human power only. I'm *not* a superior athlete. When I was riding fixed, I could manage ~33 mph downhill, which for that bike (geared for hills), meant ~165 rpm "assisted" cadence on 165mm cranks. (Assisted in the sense that if you don't keep up the bike will buck you right off.)
You can easily find BMX cranks with 140mm on up to 175mm cranks. They will come in 110 BCD, so will use "generic" MTB rings. Try 155's first, you might like them. If not, they're cheap and you can always move them on ebay or craigslist.
Just a thought,
John
nice ring Miles :lol:
what do you mean hovis zone LOL - ok maybe i can do a little quicker, just lazy see.
Good call John i did have 150mm when i was on 20"'s and i really liked the short stroke, plenty of food for thought there, i'll put the schlumpf to one side for a bit and try out pedal cadence one the sram arrives and i get it laced.
By the way Kim and Mike, i'll get some pics up of the various goods for sale very shortly!!
D
what do you mean hovis zone LOL - ok maybe i can do a little quicker, just lazy see.
Good call John i did have 150mm when i was on 20"'s and i really liked the short stroke, plenty of food for thought there, i'll put the schlumpf to one side for a bit and try out pedal cadence one the sram arrives and i get it laced.
By the way Kim and Mike, i'll get some pics up of the various goods for sale very shortly!!
D
AussieJester
1 TW
Miles said:60! What a wussy
Well...he does play SOCCER so we can expect him to be to 'manly' Miles
KiM
Right,thats another ten dollars on the reduction unit price 
ok, so im going with this:
http://www.jejamescycles.co.uk/sram-dual-drive-item84707.html
And the shifter Miles suggested - now i need a clickety box and a suitable cable???
D
ok, so im going with this:
http://www.jejamescycles.co.uk/sram-dual-drive-item84707.html
And the shifter Miles suggested - now i need a clickety box and a suitable cable???
D
AussieJester
1 TW
deecanio said:Right,thats another ten dollars on the reduction unit price
LoL... i also forgot to ask if you have heartd of the cycle shop Chain Reaction Cycles Deec? its over your way has fantastic range (although i couldnt find the sram dual speed hub you seek on their site, only thing that resembled the look were $AU1600 2.4ghz wireless rear hubs) Mate here Matt.P has bought a few things from them, they are very fast delivering items might be worth looking for future cycle needs Deec, they have a HUGE range of SRAM shifters that might be too your liking? ...
KiM
Hi Mate,
yes i bought my rims and stuff from them, i normally use chainreaction and wiggle.com as they both are reasonable on price and deliver pretty quickly.
Neither had the sram hub - its one of those damn annoying things where you type in a search (google) and they list the exact item but when you click the link it takes you to some random page on their site and the item isnt found on their search
, shot i tells thee.
Not sure if all sram shifters work with the dd hub - still im happy to get the one miles found for me, just looking for the clickety box and cable now, be nice if i could get them from one source.
$AU1600 2.4ghz wireless rear hubs ???? sounds like a wireless network hub ;p
i will post up the reduction unit and spares i have soon mate so we thrash out a deal, Mike may take my astro so i'll be swapping them towards a sram and the 3220 i already spent next months wages on :lol:
Also if anyones interested before i hit ebay i have a 22t eno and some gorgeous echo freewheel cranks for soon very soon!!!
Kim you need to let me know exactly what you want after i post pics on the reduction front mate.
D
yes i bought my rims and stuff from them, i normally use chainreaction and wiggle.com as they both are reasonable on price and deliver pretty quickly.
Neither had the sram hub - its one of those damn annoying things where you type in a search (google) and they list the exact item but when you click the link it takes you to some random page on their site and the item isnt found on their search
, shot i tells thee.Not sure if all sram shifters work with the dd hub - still im happy to get the one miles found for me, just looking for the clickety box and cable now, be nice if i could get them from one source.
$AU1600 2.4ghz wireless rear hubs ???? sounds like a wireless network hub ;p
i will post up the reduction unit and spares i have soon mate so we thrash out a deal, Mike may take my astro so i'll be swapping them towards a sram and the 3220 i already spent next months wages on :lol:
Also if anyones interested before i hit ebay i have a 22t eno and some gorgeous echo freewheel cranks for soon very soon!!!
Kim you need to let me know exactly what you want after i post pics on the reduction front mate.
D
AussieJester
1 TW
deecanio said:
All I was after is the CNC Pr0n Deec, the Mr R SiRz reduction drive unit
with the one-off freewheel fitted pulley......you mention
you also have an ENO freewheel and cranks...the eno i could be interested in
actually AM interested in as i have a extra wide freewheel hub on the way for my cruiser
to replace the Sturmey Archer 3 speed when i wish to get 'Luke-serious' about acceleration
(part of my 'New Years Resolution'...ie. building a custom e-bike that pulls harder than Luke or Methys ride) SO i will be needing an ENO & larger the better to mount inside my rear drive pulley...
I also need some flash one cranks Deec, the cranks you speak of though, are they
of the square tapered fitting variety alloy and silver...(actually colour is irrelevant i have sandpaper and buffer)
KiM
recumpence
1 GW
AussieJester said:
Seems like we are all going for more power this year.
Just wait till you see some of the rides that are being built right now!
Matt
indeed Matt, there are too many members here who've been tinkering away and not sharing :wink: you know who you are!!!!
Kim,
the cranks are not square taper bud, they are splined variety (bb's are cheap'ish) damn sexy too "echo SL"
top item here - in black, super sweet ............ http://www.thetrialsinshop.com/drivetrain.html
don't worry if they are no good, they are trials cranks and i'll have no probs shifting them on ebay
the eno i have at the cranks is a 22t - the one with the 5 "slots" for mounting stuff, currently holds my 42t 4 hole 110 bcd chainring and my 80t extron via a custom adapter.hardly used so again no probs shifting on ebay.
The Mr R reduction i will do you for a good price, but the other bits wont come too cheaply as i'll get good money for them elsewhere, however i'll do you a better discount than any ebay liberty taker if you want them
i'll give first dibs on all items here in my thread first, the reduction unit is yours to turn down so don't worry there, the motor is mike's, and the rest is up for grabs with ebay waiting!!
D
Kim,
the cranks are not square taper bud, they are splined variety (bb's are cheap'ish) damn sexy too "echo SL"
top item here - in black, super sweet ............ http://www.thetrialsinshop.com/drivetrain.html
don't worry if they are no good, they are trials cranks and i'll have no probs shifting them on ebay
the eno i have at the cranks is a 22t - the one with the 5 "slots" for mounting stuff, currently holds my 42t 4 hole 110 bcd chainring and my 80t extron via a custom adapter.hardly used so again no probs shifting on ebay.
The Mr R reduction i will do you for a good price, but the other bits wont come too cheaply as i'll get good money for them elsewhere, however i'll do you a better discount than any ebay liberty taker if you want them
i'll give first dibs on all items here in my thread first, the reduction unit is yours to turn down so don't worry there, the motor is mike's, and the rest is up for grabs with ebay waiting!!
D
AussieJester
1 TW
Ahhhh trials cranks ... no need them Deec... Just the Mr R CnC Pr0n and the 22 tooth eno for me bud
KiM
KiM
Eno meeny miiiney mo.
The eno's are in and fit very very well, at first i thought the sickbikes one didnt fit but readdress and it slipped on fine.
Im not entirely convinced of the durability under a lot of power as the only part that fits fully is the outer, the pieces with thread are not as deep, not that im complaining mind, the independant freewheels work absolutely lovely, i guess i wont know untill i've put some juice through them.
Anyways pics for all to see how they came out.
D
The eno's are in and fit very very well, at first i thought the sickbikes one didnt fit but readdress and it slipped on fine.
Im not entirely convinced of the durability under a lot of power as the only part that fits fully is the outer, the pieces with thread are not as deep, not that im complaining mind, the independant freewheels work absolutely lovely, i guess i wont know untill i've put some juice through them.
Anyways pics for all to see how they came out.
D
Attachments
ok, so i have another idea just ripe for shooting down
I have been thinking all the way that a direct drive would be the simplest way to drive the rear wheel instead of last years crank setup, but always had a niggling feeling that the 80t extron would be better on the rear (still with you on the monster btw Etard, this is just an avenue i want to explore first).
i want to revert to an idea a while back of breaking Matts reduction unit down to suit my needs (** hears kim start to cry**)
I want to know if you see guys see anything wrong with this setup:
mount the 80t extron to the sickbikes eno - no problem there have all i need already.
mount the "foot" to the bottom of the seatpost - ive tried now and it does fit without impedeing the suspension
Retain the foot complete with bearing tube (needs adjusting to line chains) and retain the shaft which already has an 11t engineered onto it.
ask Matt VERY nicely to make me a new motor arm that is longer than the current arm so that i can drop the motor below the swingarm but attach it back to the bearing tube as before, no need for extra brackets!!!
here are a few pics to help explain and show the clearences, remember the current pulley is something like 64t which could be smaller as i only need 2-1 reduction.
the only issue i may have (apart from the dreaded chain tension) is the depth of the 3220, so i may stick with a 3210 IF this is a workable soution to my drive/suspension issues
I have fitted cranks to ensure that this is all doable and they just pass, once the tube is adjusted and the pulley a little smaller everything does indeed fit so .....
Do you guys think that three clamps around the seatpost (2 yet to be drilled and tapped in the foot) would suffice to hold it steady?
Also, what are your suggestions for size of pulleys to get my 2-1 reduction? 4kw power
Can i still use the GT belts at the same width?
ok im ready throw the spanners!!!!
D
I have been thinking all the way that a direct drive would be the simplest way to drive the rear wheel instead of last years crank setup, but always had a niggling feeling that the 80t extron would be better on the rear (still with you on the monster btw Etard, this is just an avenue i want to explore first).
i want to revert to an idea a while back of breaking Matts reduction unit down to suit my needs (** hears kim start to cry**)
I want to know if you see guys see anything wrong with this setup:
mount the 80t extron to the sickbikes eno - no problem there have all i need already.
mount the "foot" to the bottom of the seatpost - ive tried now and it does fit without impedeing the suspension
Retain the foot complete with bearing tube (needs adjusting to line chains) and retain the shaft which already has an 11t engineered onto it.
ask Matt VERY nicely to make me a new motor arm that is longer than the current arm so that i can drop the motor below the swingarm but attach it back to the bearing tube as before, no need for extra brackets!!!
here are a few pics to help explain and show the clearences, remember the current pulley is something like 64t which could be smaller as i only need 2-1 reduction.
the only issue i may have (apart from the dreaded chain tension) is the depth of the 3220, so i may stick with a 3210 IF this is a workable soution to my drive/suspension issues
I have fitted cranks to ensure that this is all doable and they just pass, once the tube is adjusted and the pulley a little smaller everything does indeed fit so .....
Do you guys think that three clamps around the seatpost (2 yet to be drilled and tapped in the foot) would suffice to hold it steady?
Also, what are your suggestions for size of pulleys to get my 2-1 reduction? 4kw power
Can i still use the GT belts at the same width?
ok im ready throw the spanners!!!!
D
Attachments
etard
100 kW
I don't see why you couldn't do this D. Are you already using a wider crank setup than normal? It looks mighty close there at the left crank arm. Another option here might be to use a larger extron sprocket (like 96 tooth) so you can use a smaller reduction pulley. This might give you more room for adjustment. Also, maybe Matt can design some sort of bolt on bash guard on the end of the motor plate to protect the Astro.
recumpence
1 GW
D,
I already make a twin motor face plate that is 3.5 inches longer than the single motor plate. If that is long enough, I can send you one out of my next production run.
Matt
I already make a twin motor face plate that is 3.5 inches longer than the single motor plate. If that is long enough, I can send you one out of my next production run.
Matt
MitchJi
10 MW
Hi D,
Are you sure chain growth won't be an issue in that location?
I really like the idea of keeping Matt's reduction as opposed to a single stage reduction and the 165t rear. If you can make this work it will be much quieter and have a much stealthier appearance.
For the 3220 you should keep in mind that Matt says that belts won't work with the 3220, but he also said they work connecting his dual 3220's with 2 26t pulleys (13 teeth contacting the belt) and high tension. So with the long motor mount something like 28t/56t might work. It might be easier to go to #25 or an 8150.
I'd use Matt's clamp mounts to mount the foot to the seat tube. I think you can make this work with the shortened foot by bolting a plate to the bottom of the foot to extend it and mount the clamps to the plate.
Are you sure chain growth won't be an issue in that location?
I really like the idea of keeping Matt's reduction as opposed to a single stage reduction and the 165t rear. If you can make this work it will be much quieter and have a much stealthier appearance.
For the 3220 you should keep in mind that Matt says that belts won't work with the 3220, but he also said they work connecting his dual 3220's with 2 26t pulleys (13 teeth contacting the belt) and high tension. So with the long motor mount something like 28t/56t might work. It might be easier to go to #25 or an 8150.
I'd use Matt's clamp mounts to mount the foot to the seat tube. I think you can make this work with the shortened foot by bolting a plate to the bottom of the foot to extend it and mount the clamps to the plate.
AussieJester
1 TW
deecanio said:
haha..all good Deec i can put the money towards more motors...and/or a two speed Thud tranny if i can
persuade him to sellz me one
I was only reeeeally ever interested in the reduction drive for the freewheel pulleyMatt did especially for you, not really sure why you wanted it for your setup but its cool non the less LoL
Best of luck Deec... i think you should stick with the direct drive plan still though
KiM
Thanks for the reply guys, i can really see this working out for me, had an epiphany this afternoon whilst sorting through the spares and pondering the motor mount issue (again).
Etard,
im already on a 128mm bb - the pulley shown is 64t so if i can get that down by even 10 teeth i will have enough room to do this im sure, i will take advice from Matt and miles on how best to achieve 2-1, all i need.
Matt,
i had forgotten about the dual motor arms, if you get chance would you give me the measurements please and also can you show me some pics of the seatpost mounts? i'll get the diameter of the seatube asap. 31mm or close as i recall.i'd like to get all the goodness i need from you sent with the astro if you can, btw way do you have any anodised tubing? also can i source the sprockets i need for the reduction from your magic workshop - lightened and anodised would be awesome.
Also what is the size of the two grub screws in the motor pulley??? i cannot find a key to fit!!
Mitch,
chaingrowth is still a pita, although with this setup its as near the pivot point as i can get with any setup, im still expecting a little growth but i have a cunning plan with that little piece of extra tubing i have sticking out by the drive pulley
Again i'll take some good advice from matt/miles etc as to which pulleys to use for the 2-1. 8150 motor maybe, i need to get the arm from matt first so i can measure up for clearence - it occurs to me now that i dont have to go directly down from the pulley, i could go in a forwards direction and mount the motor in front of the bb - i need to look at this more but certainly using matts drive mounting i can pretty much swing the motor where i want it, a bit more measureing and i'll know what to get - i may even be able to run the 3220 in that configuration.
Kim,
cheers bud, i would like to have direct drive but two reasons are swaying me away, firstly the need for the monster sprocket, which in itself brings all new chainline issues to the table, secondly by using the reduction drive not only do i get to use the sweet sized 80t extron but i also to get to mount the motor wherever i choose (to an extent) because it doesnt matter, all i need is a good chainline to the drive sprocket, sweet.
Cheers for the help guys, still waiting for Miles and his spanners before i start building
D
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