Ebike Hydraulic Disc Brake Choices

D

Degull

100 W
Joined
Oct 12, 2011
Messages
129
Location
Toronto Canada
Hi everyone. I am installing a Bafang BBSHD mid drive on a cargo bike and I would like to use hydraulic disc brakes. I am looking for a disc brake set that has the motor cutoff sensor built into the lever that won’t break the bank. Can anyone recommend an Ebike hydraulic disc brake set? Thanks.
 
Tektro Auriga.

I caution you though, hydraulic discs don't do anything that mechanical discs don't also do, except fail in ways that are tedious and expensive to repair, and ruin themselves by oiling their own rotors and pads.
 
Chalo said:
Tektro Auriga.

I caution you though, hydraulic discs don't do anything that mechanical discs don't also do, except fail in ways that are tedious and expensive to repair, and ruin themselves by oiling their own rotors and pads.
Click to expand...
They're self adjusting, which takes the hassle out of adjusting the pads, and there's the reduction in lever pulling effort. The latter is helpful when the brakes start fading, so you don't need a vise like grip to stop near the bottom of a big descent.
 
Chalo said:
Tektro Auriga.

I caution you though, hydraulic discs don't do anything that mechanical discs don't also do, except fail in ways that are tedious and expensive to repair, and ruin themselves by oiling their own rotors and pads.
Click to expand...
Those Tektro look amazing but a little pricey. Are there any decent cheaper alternatives?

Hydraulic brakes are a pain but worth it when it comes to performance.
 
The DIY route is usually less expensive. If you use regular hydraulic levers and add the magnetic sensors, you can end up with a relatively clean install. I got these 4 piston brakes (Tektro knockoffs): Amazon.com
and these sensors: Amazon.com
and braking is great and the combo functions well.
The sensors are easy to install, the second time. The first time is trying to get the magnet and sensor to line up right and with enough of a gap, etc. Once you figure that out, it's a piece of cake. I used hot glue on the magnet to make it easy to remove and adjust, until I got the position right, and reliable. Side view before clean up:
Hot Glued.jpg
The bottom isn't flat but the sensor fits fairly securely underneath at a slight angle with the thin 2 way tape that comes with it. I have one zip tie on the cable for support, but the tape seems to hold well, and makes it easy to replace the sensor in the future if needed. The lever has a flat surface, perpendicular to the sensor, that the magnet can fit neatly against.
surfaces.jpg
In the final install, I removed the hot glue, slightly scuffed up the two surfaces, and applied two tiny drops of JB Weld epoxy since the magnet shouldn't ever need to be replaced (unless you have to replace the lever). I was going to paint it black, but once it was cleaned up and expoxied, it didn't look bad, so not a priority. Front view before clean up:
align.jpg
 
E-HP said:
They're self adjusting, which takes the hassle out of adjusting the pads,
Click to expand...

In my observation, they're self-un-adjusting as the pistons get sticky and cause brake rub. There's no fixing that on the road or trail. Compare BB7s where you click a dial with your fingertips to remove excess slack or change the centering.

E-HP said:
and there's the reduction in lever pulling effort. The latter is helpful when the brakes start fading, so you don't need a vise like grip to stop near the bottom of a big descent.
Click to expand...

I suppose that would matter, if other brakes took more than a reasonable amount of effort to apply hard. But they don't. Instead, hydraulics are likely to give you way too much stop when you jab the brakes reflexively (even though their maximum stopping power is exactly the same as cable brakes).
 
E-HP said:
The DIY route is usually less expensive. If you use regular hydraulic levers and add the magnetic sensors, you can end up with a relatively clean install. I got these 4 piston brakes (Tektro knockoffs): Amazon.com
and these sensors: Amazon.com
and braking is great and the combo functions well.
The sensors are easy to install, the second time. The first time is trying to get the magnet and sensor to line up right and with enough of a gap, etc. Once you figure that out, it's a piece of cake. I used hot glue on the magnet to make it easy to remove and adjust, until I got the position right, and reliable. Side view before clean up:
View attachment 334520
The bottom isn't flat but the sensor fits fairly securely underneath at a slight angle with the thin 2 way tape that comes with it. I have one zip tie on the cable for support, but the tape seems to hold well, and makes it easy to replace the sensor in the future if needed. The lever has a flat surface, perpendicular to the sensor, that the magnet can fit neatly against.
View attachment 334521
In the final install, I removed the hot glue, slightly scuffed up the two surfaces, and applied two tiny drops of JB Weld epoxy since the magnet shouldn't ever need to be replaced (unless you have to replace the lever). I was going to paint it black, but once it was cleaned up and expoxied, it didn't look bad, so not a priority. Front view before clean up:
View attachment 334522
Click to expand...
Well done, I have a set of Shimano hydraulic brakes that I was going to install these types of sensors. The idea of using glue to attach the sensor onto the lever doesn’t sit well with me.
 
Chalo said:
In my observation, they're self-un-adjusting as the pistons get sticky and cause brake rub. There's no fixing that on the road or trail. Compare BB7s where you click a dial with your fingertips to remove excess slack or change the centering.



I suppose that would matter, if other brakes took more than a reasonable amount of effort to apply hard. But they don't. Instead, hydraulics are likely to give you way too much stop when you jab the brakes reflexively (even though their maximum stopping power is exactly the same as cable brakes).
Click to expand...
I have had BB7’s on more than one bike. They are great and I have a set not being used. What brake lever with an integrated sensor would you use with the BB7?
 
Degull said:
I have had BB7’s on more than one bike. They are great and I have a set not being used. What brake lever with an integrated sensor would you use with the BB7?
Click to expand...
The offerings for cable brake levers with integrated switches are pretty slim and cheap. Big long flimsy levers that look like they belong on a Walmart bike. I started with those, when I was using my BB7s. But they were so cheap, I got Diacomp shorty levers and drilled them to install normally closed pushbutton switches which felt a lot better..
wired-jpg.258191
 
I am tempted to add hydraulics to my bbshd-powered trike - but same issues - I currently have big rotors and TRP Spyre mechanicals. They are normally for road bikes (they make a Spyke for MTB) - difference is the cable pull required. I have some "flat bar" levers that can be set for either pull type, and they work well, along with the add-on sensors. I have them "glued" on - the attachment etc is very reliable, although I find one of mine is slow to release cutoff in cold weather. The Bafang came with kinda clunky levers with the built in sensors, but the pull is wrong anyway.

If you use the Ebike Tektros, you will likely find they have, like Magura ebike brakes, a red 2-pin HiGo connector, so needs adapted to the three pin normally yellow Bafang style. Others suggest doing away with sensors altogether - but I'd rather not do that. Somebody should make an inline sensor for 5mm hydraulic lines. More to leak and fail, though.

Options include sticking with what I have, which is simple and pretty good - the Spyres are two-piston opposing design and adjust well, good force. Or, add the sensors to hydraulic levers - some are easier than others to mount. I also found some Shimano "clones" from China on Aliexpress and Amazon that have levers with built-in yellow HiGos. Some reviewers have pointed out some of these need rewired to work with Bafang despite being advertised as compatible. These "hybrid" calipers like the Juintech etc would seem to offer a mechanical actuation (cable) but internal hydraulic, so same kind of "auto adjust".

I know Chalo often says go mechanical, and likes the Spyres. My thing is I have a heavy, fast trike and want the best stop I can get. The mechanicals are fine, I think, as I have compression-less housings that are rather short as the trike has two front brakes.
 
Last edited:
ccihon said:
I am tempted to add hydraulics to my bbshd-powered trike - but same issues - I currently have big rotors and TRP Spyre mechanicals. They are normally for road bikes (they make a Spyke for MTB) - difference is the cable pull required. I have some "flat bar" levers that can be set for either pull type, and they work well, along with the add-on sensors. I have them "glued" on - the attachment etc is very reliable, although I find one of mine is slow to release cutoff in cold weather. The Bafang came with kinda clunky levers with the built in sensors, but the pull is wrong anyway.

If you use the Ebike Tektros, you will likely find they have, like Magura ebike brakes, a red 2-pin HiGo connector, so needs adapted to the three pin normally yellow Bafang style. Others suggest doing away with sensors altogether - but I'd rather not do that. Somebody should make an inline sensor for 5mm hydraulic lines. More to leak and fail, though.

Options include sticking with what I have, which is simple and pretty good - the Spyres are two-piston opposing design and adjust well, good force. Or, add the sensors to hydraulic levers - some are easier than others to mount. I also found some Shimano "clones" from China on Aliexpress and Amazon that have levers with built-in yellow HiGos. Some reviewers have pointed out some of these need rewired to work with Bafang despite being advertised as compatible. These "hybrid" calipers like the Juintech etc would seem to offer a mechanical actuation (cable) but internal hydraulic, so same kind of "auto adjust".

I know Chalo often says go mechanical, and likes the Spyres. My thing is I have a heavy, fast trike and want the best stop I can get. The mechanicals are fine, I think, as I have compression-less housings that are rather short as the trike has two front brakes.
Click to expand...
Thanks for suggestions. Making an in-line 5mm sensor hydraulic brake sensor would be grand. I noticed from searching around online some nice people have created a file for a 3D printed adapter that holds the sensor and wire in place on a Shimano lever. That looks promising but I don’t have a 3D printer.
 
Degull said:
I have had BB7’s on more than one bike. They are great and I have a set not being used. What brake lever with an integrated sensor would you use with the BB7?
Click to expand...
I wouldn't use switched brake levers any more than I'd pick a stove that turns off the heat when I step out of the kitchen. Lever-motor interlocks are just a way to add an unnecessary point of failure and to limit the kinds of levers you can use. My separation between braking and throttling is done with software (the kind installed in my head). If your operating system doesn't support that function, maybe e-cycling isn't for you.

Would you only drive a car that cut off the engine every time you touched the brake pedal? And if not, why is a sub-100 pounds, sub-2 horsepower vehicle more in need of this function than a >3000 pound, >100 HP one?
 
I agree pedaling and braking don't normally happen together. Every commercial ebike I have seen includes this system, so I assume must be from some safety concern or even mandate. This forum is full of runaway or stuck throttle stories... Maybe urban legends? If cutoffs are done well, they offer no real negatives, I think.
 
ccihon,

Redundancy of safety features is part of the standard process in engineering design for reliable safety.

If you want additional safety features for your ebike —— Add Them.

This thread is full of vintage 2009 opinionated crap but cheers to freedom of speech, so sort it out.

About brakes: a higher [stopping] hand force takes more time to generate than a hand braking force that would be half as much. So the distance rolled from the initial pull is longer with brakes requiring a heavy hand that those brakes able to stop with easy finger pulls.

Even if this time difference is a mere 0.1 sec, at 30 mph this would be some 4.4 feet.

Missing a collision with even one foot of clearance is better than the hospital or jail? Or the Cermetary?

BTW. — nowadays pedal bikes are likely the only vehicles that install mechanical cable brakes. You are not in this category once you install a motor.
 
Last edited:
I know many people have different opinions about the brake cutoffs. I started this thread because I would like to use hydraulic disc brakes with the motor cutoff. I was hoping to find a cheaper solution. Looks like I have to pony up and buy the more expensive Magura’s or the Tektro’s. Is there a clear winner between the two?
 
Last edited:
ccihon said:
If cutoffs are done well, they offer no real negatives, I think.
Click to expand...
They can cut power when you don't want them to. That's a negative.

The reason they are pushed on e-bikes is the same reason helmets are pushed on cyclists. Both would do more good if car drivers used them, but lots of people have a vested interest in making cycling seem more dangerous than it is.
 
Degull,

If you are looking to find a cheaper solution for cutoffs do something similar to what I did — keep your existing brake handles.

Add to handlebar mount part of the brake lever unit a SPST lever micro switch with wires going to ebrake controller wire set. You will also need to add a small bolt-like post to the brake handle in such a position that as the brake handle is pulled the post begins to touch the lever on the micro switch.

I will post a photo of this
 
Chalo says,

‘They can cut power when you don't want them to. That's a negative.”


Simple solution: disconnect the ebrake wire when you do not want losing power.
 
Chalo,

Your comparison to helmets leads to neglectful thinking.

The thinking here in the US is kind of like it is fine for an individual to do the stupid things as he wishes as long as the accidents he creates do not hurt others. Poor brakes can hurt others.
 
Last edited:
Degull said:
I know many people have different opinions about the brake cutoffs. I started this thread because I would like to use hydraulic disc brakes with the motor cutoff. I was hoping to find a cheaper solution. Looks like I have to pony up and buy the more expensive Magura’s or the Tektro’s. Is there a clear winner between the two?
Click to expand...
You mentioned you have Bafang motor. Both of these brakes will need the connectors and pinouts changed to work with these, or adapters are available for the red two pin to yellow three pin. Magura makes a great ebike 4 piston brake, but some dislike that these come with plastic levers.
 
Degull,

Here are 2 pic of home made brake switches. The screws are 2mm.


A 2mm threaded hole was made in the brakes handle to hold a bolt of sufficient height to touch the micro switch lever.
ED3ABCB7-6D81-45FD-B093-1595BFFFEC95.jpeg

On this Hayes brake body the micro switch was held in place with super mount tape.

On this Shimano brake body a location existed where 2 threaded holes would miss any necessary structure of the brake body.
1D5EB832-A77F-461A-BACB-1277A9BA6A40.jpeg

I have Hayes 4 piston brakes on 4 of my edirtbikes.


These brake switches are adjustable so lighter taps on the brakes will not kill the motor power. The adjustment is done by bending the micro switch lever to close electrical contact when you have the brake handle compressed to where you want the motor cutout to kick in. In this fashion of adjustment you can use the brakes somewhat hard and not kill the motor power but a harder pull will kill motor power. These switches were added to hydraulic brakes.
 
Last edited:
ccihon said:
You mentioned you have Bafang motor. Both of these brakes will need the connectors and pinouts changed to work with these, or adapters are available for the red two pin to yellow three pin. Magura makes a great ebike 4 piston brake, but some dislike that these come with plastic levers.
Click to expand...
Cut and splicing is no problem, I have a mini molex connector crimper and will make my own harness.
 
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