TSDZ2 Strange error code

[abbeswag]

Hi, I have been riding my prebuilt TSDZ2 bike for a year, and last week it had troubles turning on, showing error code E13, which I cannot find any information about. And yesterday, the bike no longer turns on, the display gives no feedback at all. The battery seems fine, so its hard to tell what the issue is. It has been cold here, but not sure if related. It uses the VLCD5 screen, and is all a year old, running stock firmware.

Bought a multimeter to try to measure voltages, but is this a known issue?
Thanks

 

[amberwolf]

What indicates that the battery is "fine"?

Normally when there is no power at all, when a system will not turn on, it means the battery itself has shut off it's output for some reason.

You can verify this by connecting the voltmeter to the battery connector wires that go to the controller, *while it is plugged into the controller*, so that you can see what happens when you try to turn the system on. If the voltage is normal before you try to turn it on, but drops when you try to turn it on, it means the BMS in the battery is turning off the output to protect the battery from a problem.

If the voltage does not drop and is normal for whatever voltage battery you have at all times, then it's something in the system itself, probably the display (since that's where the power-on circuitry is located), but could be anywhere at or beyond the battery connection.

 

[abbeswag]

Ok strangely enough it turned on today but gave me again the following error.

What does it mean? Cannot find any resources about it

 

[abbeswag]

What indicates that the battery is "fine"?

Normally when there is no power at all, when a system will not turn on, it means the battery itself has shut off it's output for some reason.

You can verify this by connecting the voltmeter to the battery connector wires that go to the controller, *while it is plugged into the controller*, so that you can see what happens when you try to turn the system on. If the voltage is normal before you try to turn it on, but drops when you try to turn it on, it means the BMS in the battery is turning off the output to protect the battery from a problem.

If the voltage does not drop and is normal for whatever voltage battery you have at all times, then it's something in the system itself, probably the display (since that's where the power-on circuitry is located), but could be anywhere at or beyond the battery connection.

Given that it turned on now I am confused as to the cause. Perhaps a cable is loose? Wondering what the error tells me though, as E03 is controller but E13 is unknown?

I haven't tested the multimeter yet. A test run indicates it works fine for the moment, but will probably error again

 

[amberwolf]

I haven't found anything for E13; you may have to ask TongSheng about it directly.
google say's that's Suzhou Tongsheng Electric Appliances Co., Ltd. Motor Meter Controller

 

[abbeswag]

No answer from them, and now no longer starting. Shall look for a cable fault now. Very strange.

Unlikely this is fixable by OSF right? This is a display issue

 

[amberwolf]

OSF might fix a software or setting issue because you'd be erasing it all and starting "from scratch" with it.

OSF is unlikely to fix a hardware issue, unless it simply doesn't use that hardware or doesn't use it the way that causes the failure/error. It might mask the issue by not reporting the problem and/or ignoring it and doing stuff anyway. (depends on what the source of the problem is)

I didn't see any answer to the first question I asked, which is "What indicates that the battery is "fine"?"

...because, power problems are almost always battery problems.

 

[abbeswag]

OSF might fix a software or setting issue because you'd be erasing it all and starting "from scratch" with it.

OSF is unlikely to fix a hardware issue, unless it simply doesn't use that hardware or doesn't use it the way that causes the failure/error. It might mask the issue by not reporting the problem and/or ignoring it and doing stuff anyway. (depends on what the source of the problem is)

I didn't see any answer to the first question I asked, which is "What indicates that the battery is "fine"?"

...because, power problems are almost always battery problems.

Since it worked just fine the other day. As long as it started it worked seamlessly. Hence my confusion.
I used the multimeter on the battery, which gave perfect 42V. I guess i have to disassemble the screen and measure if there is voltage there?

Edit: nevermind shall see if I can connect to wires from battery to controller

 

[abbeswag]

The cable going to the backlight was completely destroyed. But I disconnected that cable and it still doesn't work. Could the damaged backlight cable have damaged the system?

I also tried to measure voltage while connected, but it's a closed circuit and the cables aren't accessible? Sorry if I'm unknowledgeable, not tested this kind of thing.

 

[abbeswag]

I cannot access the motor using STLink. Perhaps the controller just randomly decided to die on me, which would be so very unfortunate.

 

[beemac]

I cannot access the motor using STLink. Perhaps the controller just randomly decided to die on me, which would be so very unfortunate.

if the 6v/5v and 0v lines were shorted- then it's quite possible the controller or parts of it are fried unfortunately. Replacing the controller is a medium to tricky job depending on your diy skills - but it's a bit simpler since you're running stock firmware so you don't have a temp sensor to reattach and replacement controllers are pretty cheap.

 

[abbeswag]

if the 6v/5v and 0v lines were shorted- then it's quite possible the controller or parts of it are fried unfortunately. Replacing the controller is a medium to tricky job depending on your diy skills - but it's a bit simpler since you're running stock firmware so you don't have a temp sensor to reattach and replacement controllers are pretty cheap.

That's unfortunate. However, randomly it worked again just fine, then stopped again, which is why I had some belief it wasn't a fried controller.
However I'll order a new controller. That's a shame but I guess that's how it is.

Also, I was given an error code by the controller. It didn't just up and die, weirdly enough.

The cable that was messed up was the backlight.

 

[beemac]

That's unfortunate. However, randomly it worked again just fine, then stopped again, which is why I had some belief it wasn't a fried controller.
However I'll order a new controller. That's a shame but I guess that's how it is.

Also, I was given an error code by the controller. It didn't just up and die, weirdly enough.

The cable that was messed up was the backlight.

it's impossible to tell 100% but generally shorting things isn't good, a way to check if the controller is alive is to tap the serial comms to see if it's sending serial data to the display - but setting all that up is probably more work than replacing the controller.

Oh - how is your speed sensor? That's one of the most common reasons for a tsdz2 to stop providing assist - no idea what error that gives from stock firmware. If you haven't already - check all cable connections, sorry if that's stating the obvious!

 

[abbeswag]

it's impossible to tell 100% but generally shorting things isn't good, a way to check if the controller is alive is to tap the serial comms to see if it's sending serial data to the display - but setting all that up is probably more work than replacing the controller.

Oh - how is your speed sensor? That's one of the most common reasons for a tsdz2 to stop providing assist - no idea what error that gives from stock firmware. If you haven't already - check all cable connections, sorry if that's stating the obvious!

Yeah that looks complicated! All the tools I have is an stlink with the appropriate cables. But the display is not turning on at all anymore, zero response so error code isn't applicable anymore, unfortunately.

I don't think the speed sensor is too relevant, the motor doesn't turn on and show something on the display, which is the bigger issue.

I have ordered another STLink, read somewhere they had issues with a clone. Otherwise I'm out of ideas and it's replacing controller that's next on the list.

 

[beemac]

Yeah that looks complicated! All the tools I have is an stlink with the appropriate cables. But the display is not turning on at all anymore, zero response so error code isn't applicable anymore, unfortunately.

I don't think the speed sensor is too relevant, the motor doesn't turn on and show something on the display, which is the bigger issue.

I have ordered another STLink, read somewhere they had issues with a clone. Otherwise I'm out of ideas and it's replacing controller that's next on the list.

Update the firmware on the stlink if you haven't already - and tbh I had many occasions when I was playing with osf where the controller seemed dead and trying again and again, zeroing option bytes, checking connections and it would come back to life...

 

[2Phast2Delirious]

It has been cold here, but not sure if related.

Try using a different battery to see if the error code is still present.
Error 13 (Err 13) appears on your bike when it is too hot to charge

 

[beemac]

Yeah that looks complicated! All the tools I have is an stlink with the appropriate cables. But the display is not turning on at all anymore, zero response so error code isn't applicable anymore, unfortunately.

I don't think the speed sensor is too relevant, the motor doesn't turn on and show something on the display, which is the bigger issue.

I have ordered another STLink, read somewhere they had issues with a clone. Otherwise I'm out of ideas and it's replacing controller that's next on the list.

TSDZ2 EBike wireless standard (like Specialized Turbo Levo) - OpenSource

@rananna and other developers, I burned 2 times a wireless board, while it was connected to my PC using the STLinkV2 clone and the also connected to the 58V of battery, provided by the the motor controller LCD connection. The board did work for some time and I think the issue may happen when...

endless-sphere.com

 

[abbeswag]

Update the firmware on the stlink if you haven't already - and tbh I had many occasions when I was playing with osf where the controller seemed dead and trying again and again, zeroing option bytes, checking connections and it would come back to life...

Thanks for the tip.

TSDZ2 EBike wireless standard (like Specialized Turbo Levo) - OpenSource

@rananna and other developers, I burned 2 times a wireless board, while it was connected to my PC using the STLinkV2 clone and the also connected to the 58V of battery, provided by the the motor controller LCD connection. The board did work for some time and I think the issue may happen when...

endless-sphere.com

Once I get the next STLink I'll go Sherlock and attempt all methods of resuscitation of my dearest Tongsheng.

Try using a different battery to see if the error code is still present.
Error 13 (Err 13) appears on your bike when it is too hot to charge

That's strange, would the inverse apply as well? It wasn't that cold last time it appeared though.
Dont think i have another battery, this is my only ebike

 

[beemac]

Try using a different battery to see if the error code is still present.
Error 13 (Err 13) appears on your bike when it is too hot to charge

Where did you get that info from? Is it definitely related to TSDZ2? The TSDZ2 has no way (with stock firmware and no hardware modifications) of knowing the temperature of anything...

 

[2Phast2Delirious]

I apologies; this was all that came up in a Google search. He did mention the cold weather, so I reasoned that there might be a connection.

 

[beemac]

Thanks for the tip.

Once I get the next STLink I'll go Sherlock and attempt all methods of resuscitation of my dearest Tongsheng.

That's strange, would the inverse apply as well? It wasn't that cold last time it appeared though.
Dont think i have another battery, this is my only ebike

Do you have an oscilloscope? If you do that's another way to tell if it's alive. But I know it's not something many people have!

Motor controller

Has information about the various controller signals and so on - if you do have a fancy multimeter or oscilloscope it might help you diagnose.

 

[abbeswag]

Do you have an oscilloscope? If you do that's another way to tell if it's alive. But I know it's not something many people have!

Motor controller

Has information about the various controller signals and so on - if you do have a fancy multimeter or oscilloscope it might help you diagnose.

I do have a multimeter. But I'll hold off on disassembling the motor until replacement controller is here.
No oscilloscope

 

[abbeswag]

Bought another STLink, now i get error 0x04. So most likely dead controller. In two weeks I'll get the new one, will update. Any tips for changing the controller?

 

[abbeswag]

if the 6v/5v and 0v lines were shorted- then it's quite possible the controller or parts of it are fried unfortunately. Replacing the controller is a medium to tricky job depending on your diy skills - but it's a bit simpler since you're running stock firmware so you don't have a temp sensor to reattach and replacement controllers are pretty cheap.

I didn't even check. This controller, is it locked or open? Since I read that new controllers might have locked firmware?

 

[beemac]

I didn't even check. This controller, is it locked or open? Since I read that new controllers might have locked firmware?

they're not locked as such, but some vendors use a different, 32 rather than 8 bit mcu and no-one has ported the open source firmware as yet to that platform. From the images in the link I posted - if the images match what is delivered - they are compatible with the osf. You can see the 1cm or so square 44 pin stm8 on the right hand side of the controller pcb. The non-compatible controller has more, smaller ICs visible through the potting. If it's got a 1.5x0.75cm or so rectangular IC in the middle and the 1cm square chip on the rhs - then it's an old, osf-compatible controller board.