Voicecoils's 2nd build: Giant DH Team

[voicecoils]

Did you not have that bolted down

I can hear the wife screaming at you now while you try to explain the scuff marks going all the way across the room.....
Would have made for great video!

So was that wobble caused by the axle sliding side to side in the stand or from hub being off axis?

-methods

On an unrelated note, I came across a bizarre sea creature while image.googling for something totally different:

Now, back to the topic at hand. If I had bolts I'd bolt it down. Gotta get some lug nuts from supercheapauto, thanks for the heads up.

The wobble was mostly from the truing stand not being stiff but a little in the disc / sidecover. I have to double check that the disc is dead flat. If it is, I'll pop the sidecover off and 'shim' it from underneath. Probably a bit painstaking but the result should be a dead straight / true disc.

My girlfriend was not around to roll her eyes and run for cover.

 

[methods]

Good thing about automotive lug nuts is that they are longer.
Grabs lots of threads so the chances of stripping becomes much smaller.

Today I disassembled my office chair, shimmed the piston on the bottom, and bolted it into the seat post hole on my chopper bike.
Rode up and down the street like a Gangster.
I have no idea why but my 36V 20A Crystalyte just popped 1Ah into the trip.
Was totally lame trying to pedal a chopper bike while sitting in an office chair. . .

-methods

 

[Almasi]

Can you please post picture to the frame drop out modification...I'm going to see a used 2004 Team DH tomorow...I probably buy it...so let me know how hard it was to do!

Robin

 

[voicecoils]

Can you please post picture to the frame drop out modification...I'm going to see a used 2004 Team DH tomorow...I probably buy it...so let me know how hard it was to do!

Robin

I don't have a photo for you yet because I don't have the swingarm back.

What's involved is tig welding the thru-axle set screw slot closed and then cutting a vertical dropout into the frame. This will let the hubmotor sit in the frame but because the thru-axle is 12mm and the X5 has 10mm axles it's not strongly secured. So, what's being done is 5mm plates of stainless steel are being made to bolt to the outside of the back of the frame. They securely hold the 14mm X5 axle with 10mm flats and act as torque arms.

If you have time and a workshop and can weld aluminium work with steel then you should be fine :wink:

If not, consider it a big job to get someone else to do. The X5 weighs a tonne and generates a heap of torque against the frame so it has to be secured properly.

Newer DH Comp / DH Team frames have 150mm axle spacing so that's another thing worth considering. It would give you more space to fit a disk brake rotor, 8spd screw on cassette and wide torque plates / torque arms.

Cheers!

 

[voicecoils]

Was totally lame trying to pedal a chopper bike while sitting in an office chair. . .
-methods

You must be in a unique neighbourhood if that gets you street cred :lol:

You need to get a trike with a nubmotor, then just tie two strings to the handlebars and ride behind it in an office chair. Maybe carry a whip?

 

[Kurt]

I am wrapping the swing arm up to post to voicecoils tomorrow morning.The job shouldn't have taken very long at all .Turns out it was bad timing for me. After some natural disasters in my area, x mass obligations and the need to look after my 2 year old daughter. I found myself short of spare time. Sorry for the hold up.

Fortunately Voicecoils has been very understanding and I hope it works out for him. I took a couple of pics before wrapping it up.

Kurt.

 

[voicecoils]

That looks awesome !!!

8) 8) 8)

I'm very impressed and excited to get the bike going. Looking forward to picking it up at the post office later this week.

THANKS KURT

 

[deecanio]

now they look like some proper dropouts for an x5, nice job 8)

 

[voicecoils]

now they look like some proper dropouts for an x5, nice job 8)

Does look like a great job. They'll be quite a bit of ally and stainless holding the X5 in it's place

The plates Kurt made up will act as torque arms, in the first pic he posted you can see at the back are ''dowels" between the swingarm members. They'll prevent them from twisting along with the set screws holding the stainless plates in place. It's a good solution he's come up with IMO.

Can't wait to pick them up at the post office.

 

[Almasi]

The only thing I'm worry is were he welded....all Aluminium Mountain Bike get a heat treatment to remove the stress caused by those weld...otherwise it crack very easy.

That's what I'm concern with my team DH, do I get the back end re-welded or just make some nice stainless plate over it...if I get it welded, then I would probably go for Heat treatment or Cryo treatment.

Robin

 

[Kurt]

The aluminium part of the drop out slot isn't doing anything any more. In fact because the stock axle hole was a larger diameter than the x5's the drop out slot in the aluminium is just allowing the x5 axle to slot into the SS plate. So that the axle is in the same position as stock.This helps when trying to use the standard de railer and disk calliper mounting position .

Some of the weight is applied to the top of the aluminium slot but no twisting force on the sides.The very rear section of the stock drop out was hollow with tapped holes and countersunk holes in it. So didn't want to rely on it for any strength because like you said its not heat treated and welding it up was more cosmetic then to strengthen it.

My bike has 5mm steel drop outs and I run the x5 in them. The ss is a lot stronger + they are a very snug fit .

Kurt.

 

[voicecoils]

The only thing I'm worry is were he welded....all Aluminium Mountain Bike get a heat treatment to remove the stress caused by those weld...otherwise it crack very easy. That's what I'm concern with my team DH, do I get the back end re-welded or just make some nice stainless plate over it...if I get it welded, then I would probably go for Heat treatment or Cryo treatment.

Robin

So you picked up the bike Robin? Cool! 8)

Kurt did address the heat treating issue IIRC. But I can't remember what he did. He might chime in and explain.

With the stainless dropouts in place, as long as the rear end of the swingarm doesn't shear off totally, everything should be pretty solid.

You might be able to make stainless plates that either put the dropout below the original thru axle or behind it. Both change the bike's geometry slightly but the plates could bolt up to tapped holes in the original drop-out area and through the thru axle hole. It's a thought at least...

 

[voicecoils]

Too quick kurt! :wink:

 

[Almasi]

So you picked up the bike Robin? Cool! 8)

Kurt did address the heat treating issue IIRC. But I can't remember what he did. He might chime in and explain.

With the stainless dropouts in place, as long as the rear end of the swingarm doesn't shear off totally, everything should be pretty solid.

You might be able to make stainless plates that either put the dropout below the original thru axle or behind it. Both change the bike's geometry slightly but the plates could bolt up to tapped holes in the original drop-out area and through the thru axle hole. It's a thought at least...

I re-edited this post...

I now have my Giant Team DH with Boxxer Team fork....this bike is soooo smooth...but really make you want some big power to go fast

Here is the before pictures... I will make a new thread once it's ready in 1 or 2 months!

Robin Almasi

 

[Almasi]

I re-edited my post above...

 

[voicecoils]

looks great, what size frame is that?

I think mine is a large. Bit of space for batteries in the frame as you've probably already seen in my thread a few pages back.

This frame design really tucks the rear suspension out of the way of everything but does not compromise the 8" of travel.

Nice forks, mine are more old school but should do the job.

 

[voicecoils]

Click this link to see a side shot of my frame again:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6475&start=60#p102621


That's with 24" rims and 2.175" tires IIRC Leaves a bit more room around the swingarm area for non-hub builds

As you can see, 72v10Ah of headway cells plus BMS fit no problem. With a custom configuration (and BMS mounted elsewhere) you could probably fit another few cells in there

 

[Almasi]

I will go with 12 pack of Lipo 22.2Volt 5Amp(6 Cell) wired in 24S3P or 12S6P) 88.8V or 44.4V nominal voltage (all that in the frame)

And probably an extra pack mounted between the 2 crown of the fork (4 more 6S pack to make a total of 24S4P or 12S8P)

16 X 715 grams make a whole pack weight 25 pounds(1776Watt/hrs) or about 19 pounds (1332Watt/hrs) without extra pack.

It's a 18'' frame.

Robin

 

[voicecoils]

I will go with 12 pack of Lipo 22.2Volt 5Amp(6 Cell) wired in 24S3P or 12S6P) 88.8V or 44.4V nominal voltage (all that in the frame) And probably an extra pack mounted between the 2 crown of the fork (4 more 6S pack to make a total of 24S4P or 12S8P) 16 X 715 grams make a whole pack weight 25 pounds(1776Watt/hrs) or about 19 pounds (1332Watt/hrs) without extra pack.
It's a 18'' frame. Robin

Cool, lot of Lipo between your legs

I have ~740 Wh of energy for ~9kg Lifepo4 battery incl BMS & shrinkwrap. You might want to consider saving the space in front of the forks for a controller? It's a good spot for cooling and a pretty easy mount location 8)

 

[deecanio]

nice 8)

D

 

[voicecoils]

DH Comp / DH Team build club

Is it me or have the smiley faces gone alien shape after the forum upgrade? :|

 

[Drunkskunk]

Daaaaamn, thats a lot of Lipo.
Those Dropouts look good. that thing should take all kinds of abuse.
You are going to abuse it properly, right?

 

[Mark_A_W]

I've played with Lipo - first on RC planes, which made me realise a brushless motor and Lithium could do wonders for a bike, and I had a Lipo booster on my bike.

Nice and light and all...but the problem is they only last a year

 

[voicecoils]

I've played with Lipo - first on RC planes, which made me realise a brushless motor and Lithium could do wonders for a bike, and I had a Lipo booster on my bike.

Nice and light and all...but the problem is they only last a year

Do you mean 365 cycles and they're dead or they die in 365 days whether used or not?

We'll have to see how our headway cells fare. If mine are still kicking along in 3000 cycles I'll be pretty stoked

 

[Mark_A_W]

Bit of both, but they basically die in a year or a year and a half sitting on the shelf.


All my bike and plane lipos are dead now.