DIY eBike BLDC Motor Controller

texaspyro said:
Alan B said:
Once we have a working motor control algorithm...

Gee, you've had the micros for a couple days now... Where's the beast? :roll: Gary would have been though a half dozen iterations of the circuit board by now :lol:

Chips arrived 24 hours ago. Wish I could work on it that much!
 
ZapPat said:
hummm... I calculate the L/R of a motor with 0.000026H and 0.04Ohms as being about 650us? 1us would seem like an insanely short electrical time constant for any motor it seems to me. I checked Justin's simulator and collected his L and R data for a few different motors and found these L/R results for DD hubs: 9C - ~2.2ms ; Xlite5302 - 1.7ms.

So if the L/R ratio really is about 1/3rd, passing from 16kHz PWM to about 44kHz or so should compensate for the difference in the motor's electrical time constant difference, and we would then have similar current ripple to deal with.

Pat

Yes, my bad, fingers must have slipped on the calculator. You're right, it's 650uS. Moral of the story? Check for obvious errors BEFORE hitting 'submit'.............. :oops:

I'm looking to up the PWM rate to around 30kHz, largely because going any faster starts to present EMI challenges. It seems that the current crop of controllers deliberately slug the FET switching times down (by using big gate resistors) presumably in an attempt to reduce EMI (my guess is that they have to meet EMC regs when selling in the West from normal retail outlets). Upping the PWM frequency means reducing FET switching times, which may create some additional EMI problems. Until I try it I won't know if it's a real or imaginary problem.

As far as I can tell, Chinese controllers seem to switch the FETs with transition times of a few uS, rather than a couple of hundred nS or so that would be fairly easy to get, at least at the low currents they are set to when they leave the factory. There doesn't seem to be a cost-engineering reason for this; the driver transistors seem up to delivering more gate current, but it's being limited by the high value gate resistors. My conclusion is that this is an EMI reduction measure, but if others have any other ideas as to why they do this it might help the FET/driver design part of this threads subject.

Jeremy
 
The reason they switch so slow is to make the needs of the caps to be minimal.

Likewise, even with good caps, it can be really tough to keep the fet gates from ringing if you have a very fast switching time mixed with a very steep di/dt.
 
liveforphysics said:
The reason they switch so slow is to make the needs of the caps to be minimal.

Likewise, even with good caps, it can be really tough to keep the fet gates from ringing if you have a very fast switching time mixed with a very steep di/dt.


Good point, the caps are probably a significant cost element, plus they take up valuable board space, so anything they can do to cut back on them is probably a good cost-saving measure.

I take your point about stopping the gates ringing from the lead inductance/gate capacitance combination, but it only takes a modest gate resistor (maybe in the 5 to 20 ohm range) to do this usually, not the whacking great 910 ohm gate turn-on resistor that XieChang use on the Hi side, for example. They deliberately slug Hi side gate turn-on current to less than about 13mA peak...................

Jeremy
 
You can find better performance with the aid of a little ferrite bead around the gate's leg, and slightly less resistance.

In this way you can manage a bit faster switching times, but with less ringing than just lower resistance alone would provide.
 
Jeremy Harris said:
I'm looking to up the PWM rate to around 30kHz, largely because going any faster starts to present EMI challenges. It seems that the current crop of controllers deliberately slug the FET switching times down (by using big gate resistors) presumably in an attempt to reduce EMI (my guess is that they have to meet EMC regs when selling in the West from normal retail outlets). Upping the PWM frequency means reducing FET switching times, which may create some additional EMI problems. Until I try it I won't know if it's a real or imaginary problem.
It's important to seperate the PWM frequency from the fundamental switching event's pulse frequency. Although I think you realise this already from your quote above, I just wanted to make it clearer that the PWM frequency is usually at least 100 times lower than the actual switching event itself. I think this is what you are hinting at above, that having your FETs switch too slow will limit your maximum usefull PWM frequency simply because the switching losses will become more and more dominant as the PWM frequency is raised. So the solution is to switch faster, but without creating huge amounts of EMI from switching event ringing, yes?

However it is my opinion that you should have not too much trouble at least doubling the switching speed compared to cheap ebike controllers if you take care with trace layout and with high frequency bypassing. And when I say high frequency bypassing, we're talking about an event in the 1MHz~10MHz range, where electrolytics become all but useless because of their physical properties. The electrolytics will handle the much slower PWM ripple. I recommend using multi-layer ceramic chip capacitors for high frequency bypassing, and placed very close across each phase right by the FETs. A single minuscule 1210 ceramic chip cap has an ESR as low as a large "low-ESR" electrolytic, but even more importantly has a much lower inductance!


liveforphysics said:
You can find better performance with the aid of a little ferrite bead around the gate's leg, and slightly less resistance.
In this way you can manage a bit faster switching times, but with less ringing than just lower resistance alone would provide.
Adding inductance in the gate drive path is not something I've seen recommended to avoid gate drive ringing. In fact the main objective of putting lots of effort and time in desiging the gate drive path layout is to *avoid* inductance in this loop. LFP, If you do have a document describing advantages of adding inductance to the gate drive loop I would be curious to see it?


Pat
 
The beads are also good for RF suppression. Hate for some stray RF from a nearby transmitter to trigger any of those big FETS at the wrong moment at several MHZ.

Thinking about Capacitors. At 5AM, half asleep. Some imperfections are likely.

Transients are best hanled by small monilithic ceramic caps very close to the FETs, as described above. But this is not about transients.

I keep thinking the right thing to do is fire up LTSpice and enter an effective diagram of the system including battery, switch, capacitors and the motor inductance. Plus all the resistances. Sometime. Not now.

The purpose of the capacitor bank is to supply short-term current to the motor inductance when the FET switch is closed. The worst case is probably when the PWM is at 50% duty cycle where the discharge time is as long as the charge time.

We can get the sag voltage of the capacitors from i = C * dV/dT where i is the battery current, C is the capacitance, dV is the voltage sag and dT is the time of the decay, or the PWM on time.

The effect of the ESR is two fold as it causes voltage drop in both the charge and discharge portions of the cycle. dV = 2* i * esr. It also causes heating in the capacitors P = i * i * esr. The voltage drop from ESR needs to be added to the capacitor voltage drop to get the drop at the capacitor terminals since the ESR resistance is internal to the capacitor.

Note also that the resistance of everything from the motor to the batter plus battery resistance also causes voltage drop but only once not twice. dV = i * R. The heating in this is more distributed but causes problems at connectors where it is concentrated and better insulated.

Note that lowering the resistance of the battery, and the resistance and inductance of the path to the battery helps reduce capacitor ripple.

So how bad is the effect of ESR? Assume for a moment we have a 10 milli-ohm ESR cap bank (which might be 5 parallel 50 milliohm caps). At 50 amps that would be E = i * r or 0.5V drop. Remember this happens in both charge and discharge cycles so it doubles to 1.0V Ripple from ESR. Assuming the battery is not helping which is not true and is worst case.

Heat from ESR would be 50A * 50A * 10 milliohms. 25 Watts. Divided across say 5 caps so 5 watts each. How to heatsink a capacitor?

How about the capacitor bank size? Assume our caps are 200 uF each and we have five of them for a total of 1000 uF. Assume we are switching at 20 khZ so the total period is 50uS. The discharge time is half so 25uS. 50A = 1000uF * dV/25uS. dV = 50A*25uS/1000uF. dV = 1250/1000 or 1.25V. This is the capacitor sag, not including the ESR drop.

So we add 1.0V from ESR ripple to 1.25V from capacitor sag to get 2.25V total capacitor ripple. Both the ESR and the capacitance contribute about equally in this somewhat randomly chosen example.

Interesting. Really need to model this. Using a low impedance battery and a low impedance path will help this a lot. Your capacitors will depend on it.
 
I find that it's much easier to think about the questions of capacitors, ESR, ESL, etc from a frequency-domain perspective.

If you dig all the way down, the goal is for the FETs to see an ideal voltage source with zero or very low impedance at all frequencies present in the current waveform. The last part is the key.

Let's think about what the frequency content of the current is going to look like. Obviously there is a large DC component. There will be large components at the PWM frequency and it's harmonics. Pat is also absolutely correct that the switching transients contain a lot of higher-frequency energy. If the turn-on/off times are 1 us, that will add components at 1 MHz and higher harmonics. That means that we need to make sure the FETs see a low impedance from DC to around 10 MHz or so.

We all know that the battery is not an ideal voltage source. The battery and wires have resistance and inductance. The resistance is pretty small with good batteries, but the inductance is a problem because it means the battery has high impedance at high frequencies (Z = j*w*L, where w=2*pi*f). That's where the capacitors come in, because an ideal cap has zero impedance at high frequencies.

Of course, capacitors aren't ideal either. They have some series resistance which we call ESR, and some series inductance we call ESL. The effect of this is that, if you look at a plot of impedance vs. frequency for a real capacitor, it will look like a "V". The point of the "V" is called the resonant frequency, which is where the ESL exactly cancels out the cap's reactive impedance (Z=1/j*w*C), leaving only the ESR. Above that frequency, the impedance rises because the ESL is now dominant. Bottom line: ESR determines what the minimum impedance of the capacitor will be, and the resonant frequency tells you how high the frequency can get before it becomes useless.

The big can electrolytics usually have resonant frequencies in the 10-100 kHz range. Good quality, low-ESR versions are usually 50-100 kHz, which is what we'd be using. This should be a clue that you need something more than just the electrolytics to deal with those high-frequency transients. Tantalum caps are a good option, but they can be pricey and often don't have high enough voltage ratings, so ceramic capacitors are the best option. MLCC chip capacitors are very good for this. Their resonant frequency is determined mostly by the package size and the dielectric type (the better dielectrics like C0G have better frequency characteristics, but the higher-value caps we need are usually X7R). A medium-sized package like 0805 usually has a resonant frequency around 10 MHz. Smaller packages have higher frequencies, larger packages have lower frequencies.

What a good design should do is choose 3 or 4 different cap values and packages, with resonant frequencies spread across the desired range, and use any many of each as you need to get the desired ESR value. The combined impedance will give us what we want, which is a uniformly low impedance across a wide range of frequencies.

The above is a LOT more important than just the bulk value of the capacitor (as many others have said already). We do need a certain amount of capacitance to supply current, but it's probably smaller than you think. It turns out that 1000 uF is enough to supply 100A for a full 20 kHz PWM period (50 us) with only 5V of sag. That's the capacitor supplying the entire current as if the battery weren't even there. Realistically, the caps only need to supply lots of current for a few us, and that doesn't require a huge amount of capacitance. That 1000 uF cap can supply 100A for 2 us with 0.2V sag. But it would require 2 milliohm ESR to achieve the same sag, which is obviously the stricter spec. But, the bulk of the current during these very quick transients will actually be coming from the smaller ceramic caps, so their (much lower) ESR is as or more important in reducing the transient ripple than the ESR of the big caps.

I also wanted to point out that Alan's math about the ESR-related heating is not quite right. The cap will not be supplying 50A on a continuous basis, so we need to calculate the RMS current to find the power dissipation. Since the cap is generally only supplying short pulses of current at a small duty cycle, the RMS current will be a small fraction of the peak current, maybe 2-5%. The power dissipation is then 1/2*Irms^2*ESR, which would be something like 30 mW assuming a 2.5 Arms current. Most of the big electrolytics are rated for 500-1000 mA each, which takes into account the ESR-related heating.
 
Great analysis about our capacitor needs, Eric. As we can see, It's actually mostly about those high frequency transients during FET turn on/off. The FETs may be only in this state during 1us or less, but there is a very high energy demand during this short time. This has nothing to do with the motor nor the batteries nor hardly even the electrolytic capacitors, as most of the energy needed for this transient is supplied solely by the very nearby high frequency capacitors. Of course the slower you switch your FETs, the sloppier you can get with your layout (which explains why common ebike controller switching speeds are pretty slow). Of course we still need good quality electrolytics to sustain the voltage (supply current) for the rest of the PWM cycle, but these can be further from the FETs so it is easier to fit them in usually.
 
I have found that a very good combo of caps on FET driver chips is a 10 uF tantalum, 0.1uF ceramic, and 1000 pF ceramic. You can probably ditch the 1000 pF. You want the caps as close to the driver chip as possible. And the driver chip ground as close to the FET source lead as possible... which is not always possible.

One thing that you need to be careful about is some resonant interaction in the combination of capacitors and board layout/ inductance. Checking with a scope can hide the issue because scope probe capacitance can mask the problem. I ran into this on a design once. It was only found because of a spurious peak that showed up on a spectrum analyzer.
 
Great discussion. Clearly the assumptions I made above were not accurate, but it is good to stir discussion and get to some recommendations that people can use in their designs.

This does look like a problem that can be modelled pretty well in Spice. If anyone has time/interest to do that it would be interesting.
 
This capacitor,
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&name=565-1745-ND
680uF100V27mOhm impedance. From my understanding of the above discussion, this would be the impedance at resonance, which should equal ESR, or not?
Thanks,
Bob
 
The usual rule of thumb is to pick about one value per decade, but as texaspyro says I think in this case it's fine to skip one or two of the decades. I'd probably go with 100 uF, something in the 1-10 uF range, and something in the 0.1-1 uF range. If was going to be really aggressive about trying to get a fast turn on, I'd probably use both 1.0 uF and 0.1 uF, or maybe 1 uF and 0.01 uF. I'm not sure there's much utility in going smaller, since a 0.01 uF cap should have a resonant frequency well above 10 MHz.

I'm curious where you've found tantalum caps at useful voltages for FET drivers. The highest I've seen are 50V parts, and those tend to be large and pricey. I think you could probably do fairly well using ceramic disc caps for that range, maybe a 2.2 uF or so. At moderate frequencies I don't think the leads should cause any great trouble and they're cheap.

Kemet has a nice little mini-SPICE program you can download free from their website. It contains all the component data for their tantalum and ceramic chip lines (sorry, no electrolytics). You can make nice plots of Z vs. frequency for various parts, and it even lets you see what happens if you combine several together as we'd do here. You can model it in SPICE yourself if you can dig up all the requisite component data, too.

oldswamm said:
This capacitor,
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSea ... 65-1745-ND
680uF100V27mOhm impedance. From my understanding of the above discussion, this would be the impedance at resonance, which should equal ESR, or not?

Depends on the exact description. Sometimes they cite a "minimum impedance" which would be equal to ESR. The industry standard is to give impedance at 100 kHz, which is more common and may or may not be equal to ESR. Loss tangent (or tan delta) is usually given too, which after some gymnastics can be used to back out the ESR separately.
 
ZapPat said:
Adding inductance in the gate drive path is not something I've seen recommended to avoid gate drive ringing....

Pat, I would look at Luke's advice on adding the ferrite beads to the gate lead, as adding frequency dependent resistance or one might say impedance. It is a technique I have used in the past to control and/or remove high frequency oscillations on the gate.

On another note, and with respect to PWM frequency. Once you have to swing around 500 to 800 nC it is going to take a little under 1 uS (give or take) unless you go to extraordinary measures in the gate drive circuit. This is going to put a limit on the base PWM frequency. I don't like to loose more than 5 to 7% of my base period on "edges." You can get faster, but the basic driver chip will be augmented with (Qty 1) SOIC14, (Qty 2) SOIC8's and a handful of discreet parts because you have to start to deal with Source lead inductance with the higher dI/dt.
 
rhitee05 said:
I'm curious where you've found tantalum caps at useful voltages for FET drivers. The highest I've seen are 50V parts, and those tend to be large and pricey.

The FET driver chips are rated at max 18-20V Vcc. I use 35V tantalums on them. I do have some 15uF 100V tantalums. Used to have some 150V mil spec ones (I think they cost Uncle Sam well over $100 each, there were dozens on the boards they were pulled from).
 
rhitee05 said:
oldswamm said:
This capacitor,
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSea ... 65-1745-ND
680uF100V27mOhm impedance. From my understanding of the above discussion, this would be the impedance at resonance, which should equal ESR, or not?

Depends on the exact description. Sometimes they cite a "minimum impedance" which would be equal to ESR. The industry standard is to give impedance at 100 kHz, which is more common and may or may not be equal to ESR. Loss tangent (or tan delta) is usually given too, which after some gymnastics can be used to back out the ESR separately.

It's rated at 100khz, but the 27uOhm impedance would indicate a MAXIMUM ESR, wouldn't it?
 
bigmoose said:
ZapPat said:
Adding inductance in the gate drive path is not something I've seen recommended to avoid gate drive ringing....

Pat, I would look at Luke's advice on adding the ferrite beads to the gate lead, as adding frequency dependent resistance or one might say impedance. It is a technique I have used in the past to control and/or remove high frequency oscillations on the gate.

On another note, and with respect to PWM frequency. Once you have to swing around 500 to 800 nC it is going to take a little under 1 uS (give or take) unless you go to extraordinary measures in the gate drive circuit. This is going to put a limit on the base PWM frequency. I don't like to loose more than 5 to 7% of my base period on "edges." You can get faster, but the basic driver chip will be augmented with (Qty 1) SOIC14, (Qty 2) SOIC8's and a handful of discreet parts because you have to start to deal with Source lead inductance with the higher dI/dt.

Great info. 1 uS times two edges times 20 for 5% is 40uS or 25 khz PWM. Right in the range.
 
I have been reading various application notes and Shane's thesis. I'm wondering if there is any value to sine commutation in ebike motors. I had expected that it might lower torque ripple, but in trapezoidal back EMF motors this does not appear to be the case. Sine commutation also seems to slightly lower both top speed and overall efficiency. Plus it costs two shunts and some complicated software.

So now I'm thinking I will drop sine commutation.
 
Alan B said:
I have been reading various application notes and Shane's thesis. I'm wondering if there is any value to sine commutation in ebike motors. I had expected that it might lower torque ripple, but in trapezoidal back EMF motors this does not appear to be the case. Sine commutation also seems to slightly lower both top speed and overall efficiency. Plus it costs two shunts and some complicated software.
So now I'm thinking I will drop sine commutation.

If our motors really had pure trapezoidal BEMF this would be true, but as we can see in this scope capture from Justin (ebikes.ca) this is not the case. This confirms to me at least that we will eventually need a more adapted waveform to drive our hubs, because we can see that there is quite a lot of torque ripple present during the commutation cycle. From what I read in this graph, it looks like we have 50% phase current ripple peaks during the cycle, which I assume translates into 50% torque ripple. No wonder we can hear our 9C's vibrate when we push them hard!



Pat
 
Interesting! Had not run across that.

I suppose that means that trapezoidal constant current would be the goal for constant torque. Interesting.

Anyone tried that?

I'm thinking that pinning out the inter-board connector for sine commutation capability (or whatever waveform) might be a good compromise, but perhaps on the first RF board don't implement the extra parts?? So the micro board is ready but the RF board would require upgrade? That would be pretty inexpensive to do and provide flexibility.
 
I think you'll find that it varies a lot from motor to motor, with no hard and fast way of knowing what you're likely to get from a particular hub. Quite a few hub motors have skewed slot stators, for example, whilst some don't. Some are wound across multiple teeth, some are tooth-by tooth wound. I've only looked at the waveform from non-hub outrunner motors and that sort of approximates a rough trapezoid, as you might expect from a straight slot stator with tooth-by-tooth windings. My guess is that the skewed slots plus the multiple tooth winding pattern that's often used in the big direct drive hubs may be the cause of the results Justin saw.

Jeremy
 
Thanks for the thoughts, Jeremy. I think that was a Nine continents in the graph, and as far as I know it does not have skewed slots (from comments here on ES), but I have not disassembled one. The winding patterns on some motors get quite tricky.

I would expect that a trapezoidal current would produce less noise. I wonder if we could accomplish that by feeding back on the battery current shunt and not require the phase shunts. I wonder if that would quiet the motor down by reducing the torque ripple?

How is your controller coming? I'd like to hear about your design tradeoffs. So far I know it is not going to use a micro but not a lot more than that. It will be interesting to see how many parts it takes without one. Are you using a motor control chip instead?

Years ago I was working on the Keck Telescope Primary Mirror control system. We were planning a micro per motor controller to deal with the stiction that was interfering with our nanometer level motions. We developed a DSP and were just about to start developing and testing with it when the project management declared that we could not have any micros on the back of the mirror where the motor control boxes were. So the hardware engineer came up with a motor controller chip to use instead. In reality this was a micro with a masked ROM motor control program on it. But it was acceptable because it was not officially a "microprocessor". In the end it failed to deal correctly with stiction, and a bunch of hardware was added to make it work acceptably. I'm convinced that if we had the ability to program the micro we could have achieved better motion control without all the extra hardware.

Please don't take the above to mean that I think you should use a micro in your design. We were pushing the state of the art in order to achieve an overall error budget totalling about 80 nanometers at the edge of each mirror if I remember correctly. 1/10 the wavelengh. This for many sources of error and six actuators (three per mirror on two mirrors driving the error at the measurement point on the slot between them). For "normal" applications I would think a motor control chip would be fine and would save a lot of software development effort while potentially still minimizing hardware. I have not researched the available motor control chips, but I would expect they are excellent these days. Alternately analog or digital designs can be made without a micro or motor control chip. So let's see it!
 
I'm playing with a bog-standard linear motor control chip, that does everything in hardware. The only reason for trying it out is that it is a simple solution that's easy to use with very few extra components. The downside is that the chips I've got (MC33033) aren't for new designs, but they were dirt cheap! The FET drivers are now 8 pin DIP NCP5181s, mainly because these better suited to the board layout than the TI drivers I was originally looking to use. The FETs are IRFP4368s. I have all the components and the board layout done, but I'm tied up fitting a new bathroom for the next week................

The MC33033 seems ideal for a really simple controller. It runs on the 12V or so FET drive power line, has an on-chip 6.2V reference supply for the Hall sensors and the throttle pot, has an on-chip current sense comparator with a 100mV threshold, can go from forward to reverse on the fly by switching one pin (handy for those building retro-direct gearboxes) and does cycle-by-cycle current limiting at the PWM rate, so is potentially quite robust when it comes to fault conditions. In terms of external component count you're looking at just a tiny handful of passive components, plus the drivers and FETs.

If I want to do some fancy stuff later on, then I can intercept the throttle and current sense lines to make the chip sing any tunes I want, using a small, slow supervisory micro.

I've attached the data sheets, if you're interested.

Jeremy

View attachment MC33033 BLDC controller.pdf
View attachment NCP5181-D.pdf
 
Thanks for the controller pdf link, Jeremy. It contains a couple example schematics that I've been 'looking' for.
I also like the way they fool it into being a brushed controller by selectively controlling the sense inputs!
I wonder if that would work with an infineon? :idea:
Bob
 
bigmoose said:
ZapPat said:
Adding inductance in the gate drive path is not something I've seen recommended to avoid gate drive ringing....
Pat, I would look at Luke's advice on adding the ferrite beads to the gate lead, as adding frequency dependent resistance or one might say impedance. It is a technique I have used in the past to control and/or remove high frequency oscillations on the gate.
After musing over your ferrite bead suggestion for a while, I started re-reading various FET drive related app notes to see if I could find mention of this somewhere. It took going though a few documents to find just one that talked about this... all the rest have only the basic "design to avoid gate drive inductance" discussion. This particular app note seperates out gate drive loop area and gate drive inductance, and describes how adding a very small amount of inductance in the form of a high frequency ferrite bead to the gate lead only can actually help remove parasitic gate drive oscillation (as you guys suggested). Keeping the gate drive loop areas as small as possible is still just as important as before, as this loop acts as an antenna. The trick seems to be adding just enough bead inductance to attenuate the oscillations, but no more.

The interresting app note is here:
The funny thing is that I did not see any mention of the bead's inductance value being added to any of the examples in this app note, but I assume that the values are very low, maybe in the highish pico-henries perhaps? They mention that the parasitic oscillations are in the 50-250Mhz range, so I guess we can use this and the gate resistor value to calculate the inductance needed to help filter out anything over this frequency. Anyways, thanks LFP and bigmoose for making me aware of this new optimisation trick!



bigmoose said:
On another note, and with respect to PWM frequency. Once you have to swing around 500 to 800 nC it is going to take a little under 1 uS (give or take) unless you go to extraordinary measures in the gate drive circuit. This is going to put a limit on the base PWM frequency. I don't like to loose more than 5 to 7% of my base period on "edges." You can get faster, but the basic driver chip will be augmented with (Qty 1) SOIC14, (Qty 2) SOIC8's and a handful of discreet parts because you have to start to deal with Source lead inductance with the higher dI/dt.
I wouldn't think about spending more than 1-2% max per PWM period in the FET switching region myself! :twisted: It seems that it doesn't really take such a big driver chip to quickly switch 400~500nC or so of FETs (2X IRFB3006's). Using TI's UCC27201 driver rated at 3A peak I get switching times quite a bit under 500ns on+off combined under full load (from memory - I am setting up new diffferent FETs right now for new tests). This is using 10ohm gate drive resistors, so with bigger FETs the resistors could be lowered to try and maintain good switching times. I don't think we really need insanely huge gate drive chips for ebike sized applications, even for the more extreme ones.

Pat
 
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