'lightest.bike' 1.7kg 1000w mid drive

[neptronix]

Got my kit. Seems to have 3 mounting plates instead of 2 ( one extra included? )

I did get a power connector.

Yes, the power connector is not keyed at all, i don't like this design choice.
On the other hand, the battery cable must bend sharply to the left once the connector cover is put on, so the wire will naturally bend in the direction and create an indicator of which way it should be inserted so this is OK.

The motor appears to contain a freewheel inside and the drag seems low enough when not engaged that you would barely notice it while pedaling with the motor off. Turning the drive sprocket in the other direction produces a lot of resistance ( as expected ), but that resistance is even.

And goddamn is it light!

 

[neptronix]

Heard back from Bikee. It's not possible to get a stator housing without all the branding engraved on it, unfortunately.

A little sandpaper and some spray paint will make your minimalist dreams come true.
The colorful label on the back can be removed.

 

[jhoexp]

How did they key it without using the housing/shell on the motor side of the connector? I have stared at all the pics showing that I can find in the thread and still don't see it, but I've missed things before.....

Uhm, I think you are right! The female connector has the notch but the male on the motor has no protruding tab. I followed the instructions on the manual to make the power cable, plugged it in without much thinking and it powered up, maybe I was just lucky! The third pin is probably not connected so you can't reverse polarity even if you plug it blindly (like I did).

 

[jhoexp]

No, mine was too small too. I sanded off excess material and was able to fit it to Bikee spider.
View attachment 337615

Ok, I'll do the same. Thanks!

About the isis spline: I'll give it another go with more grease and a better nut when my new mounting plates arrive, to see if they can be used. If I am not satisfied with it will ask for replacement under warranty. Victor told me on the phone that they had problems with the thread of the crankset that was not centered. I don't know exactly what thread he was referring too (maybe the one you screw the extractor in?), anyway they had no replacement for them yet.

 

[szkuba]

Just got the reply from Bikee on drive pinion resistance that it should run-in during first 100 to 200 km, after that the resistance should reduce

 

[Cheburator]

So finally I was able to put together my ISIS BB. Had to heat and press in spacer as it was too small. There is a tiny play but I hope it wil dissapear once I tight down everything.
Now about another bad thing - BB bearings are very low quality. There are no manufacturer markings on them, nothing exept letter H. And I have never seen such low quality seals before, they are not round and with a lot of defects, on one bearing I can even see balls through gap. And since there are no additional seals, I believe their lifespan will be very short cause of dust and water getting inside.
And they are odd size, my local bearing shop does not have them and never did. So future replacement will be a problem.


As I mentioned before, when I ordered the kit, only 2 types of mounts were available. Unfortunately they both do no fit my Turner Burner 27.5 size L. The standart mount is too short, chain is touching the chainring. And long mount is too long, chain is smashing into frame. So now I have to contact Bikee and order another mount. Maybe I can return these 2 mounts for discount?


And I have a question for you guys. Does this look like the right type of hardware?
Or maybe Bikee missed some steps in manufacturing the long mount?

About the isis spline: I'll give it another go with more grease and a better nut when my new mounting plates arrive, to see if they can be used. If I am not satisfied with it will ask for replacement under warranty.

I have took a closer look at it. I have not tight down cranks yet, just installed by hand, but already there is visible damage inside, axle is shaving away material. So you must be right, something is wrong with them.

 

[rhauff]

And I have a question for you guys. Does this look like the right type of hardware?

Good question, definitely don't want those flathead screws in a slotted hole, that would work itself loose very quickly. They need to be panhead or something with a flat bottom, and should probably have a washer as well.

 

[jhoexp]

And I have a question for you guys. Does this look like the right type of hardware?
Or maybe Bikee missed some steps in manufacturing the long mount?
View attachment 337668View attachment 337669View attachment 337670

I think you need a normal cylindrical head screw in the upper mount.
On the lower one, my standard mount plate were countersunk.
The funny thing is that in the manual they say to insert the screw from the left side, while the countersunk is on the right.

 

[pxl666]

this motor is quite expensive yet still strikes me as being half finished ...

 

[neptronix]

this motor is quite expensive yet still strikes me as being half finished ...

You know how it goes with v1.0 of like, anything

 

[amberwolf]

Most of the v1.x of things I see are things I would call alpha 0.0.1 versions.

 

[richj8990]

this motor is quite expensive yet still strikes me as being half finished ...

And the funny thing (well I find it funny but some may not) is that they are offering a discount on it now, and that it will supposedly be MORE expensive later. Which, well...not that I'm an Economics professor or anything, but I think it should be the other way around once they start up the assembly line.

CYC Stealth V3 is the safer choice for sure. I don't really think there is anything wrong with that other motor as long as you don't mind sounding like a locust swarm

 

[jhoexp]

this motor is quite expensive yet still strikes me as being half finished ...

The motor itself looks pretty refined, very compact and light and quite powerful for the size (judging from what other say, I haven't tried it yet), the problem seems to be the rest of the kit.
While the motor is all custom made and assembled in house, the bb, the isis shaft, the freewheel, etc... are all off the shelf parts, and not of the highest quality.
Probably they had not many choices and, with all the bb variations around, it's something they could not easily do, unless putting a lot of money in it.

What I am disappointed about is the instruction/assembly manual. They had 3 years and botched it.

 

[Cheburator]

I got reply from Bikee about mounts, they wanted me to play with prints of their drawings.
So it seems that with medium mount chain touches the 36T chainring and barely clears the 32T. But the Hybrid Mount takes motor a little higher.
I already have the motor bracket of the Long Mount, so with medium mount I can try both medium and hybrid (motor bracket of the Long Mount plus the Medium Mount) variants. Hope they have it in stock and will not charge me a lot of money for it and shipping.

 

[raylo32]

Yup... marketing 101, not econ. LOL. Not like that trick hasn't been used about 100,000 times.

And the funny thing (well I find it funny but some may not) is that they are offering a discount on it now, and that it will supposedly be MORE expensive later. Which, well...not that I'm an Economics professor or anything, but I think it should be the other way around once they start up the assembly line.

 

[neptronix]

What I am disappointed about is the instruction/assembly manual. They had 3 years and botched it.

What do you mean? i think the manual is pretty good, but obviously a v1.0

I got reply from Bikee about mounts, they wanted me to play with prints of their drawings.
So it seems that with medium mount chain touches the 36T chainring and barely clears the 32T. But the Hybrid Mount takes motor a little higher.
I already have the motor bracket of the Long Mount, so with medium mount I can try both medium and hybrid (motor bracket of the Long Mount plus the Medium Mount) variants. Hope they have it in stock and will not charge me a lot of money for it and shipping.
View attachment 337721View attachment 337722

Good luck, let us know how it goes!

I know i'm up a creek trying to bolt this on to one of my 3 semi recumbent bikes and may have to play musical chairs with different mounts myself

 

[raylo32]

Good thing you early adopters are masochists! Seems more like V0.5 then 1.0.

What do you mean? i think the manual is pretty good, but obviously a v1.0



Good luck, let us know how it goes!

I know i'm up a creek trying to bolt this on to one of my 3 semi recumbent bikes and may have to play musical chairs with different mounts myself

 

[rhauff]

They had a chain guide shown on some of the early photos, would prevent chain from hitting top of chainring. Maybe something to ask about?



Plenty of inexpensive options to order, Amazon $16:

 

[richj8990]

I just don't think a single chain is going to cut it on this kind of motor. I agree with others that it doesn't look like it's engaging enough teeth at one time especially on the chainring. Two chains would be a lot better, noisier yes but better from a practical point of view. Like, as in it works.

I just put on a new e-chain on a normal bike and I have to be super gentle with the 11T cassette cog or it will slip. Two different wheels now, two 11T cogs, each with less than 150 miles on them and they still don't work right because of the new chain. I can only guess of one reason: 13T engages enough chain that there is no slip under torque; 11T can't cut it w/o the chain being more broken in yet. Both cogs have exactly the same mileage on them but one engages just enough chain and the other doesn't. Same applies to this motor and chain setup. It's not going to hold over 500W, I bet that's the real problem with the rollout of the kit. Just put a drive chain with an outer chainwheel and be done with it.

 

[rhauff]

I just don't think a single chain is going to cut it on this kind of motor. I agree with others that it doesn't look like it's engaging enough teeth at one time especially on the chainring. Two chains would be a lot better, noisier yes but better from a practical point of view. Like, as in it works.

I just put on a new e-chain on a normal bike and I have to be super gentle with the 11T cassette cog or it will slip. Two different wheels now, two 11T cogs, each with less than 150 miles on them and they still don't work right because of the new chain. I can only guess of one reason: 13T engages enough chain that there is no slip under torque; 11T can't cut it w/o the chain being more broken in yet. Both cogs have exactly the same mileage on them but one engages just enough chain and the other doesn't. Same applies to this motor and chain setup. It's not going to hold over 500W, I bet that's the real problem with the rollout of the kit. Just put a drive chain with an outer chainwheel and be done with it.

Dang you must be strong! My fat bike (which I'll be putting the motor on) has an 11T and it has NEVER slipped. Maybe chain too long or derailleur spring is weak? Though I must admit my experience is not that great as main bike is belt

 

[neptronix]

Some thoughts:
The great thing about this kit is that you could re-center it to do just that - drive another chainring. You have room to slide the output gear maybe 10mm, and then the crank ring can be adjusted something like 10mm.

You would of course need to remove the torque sensing in that scenario.

You can also adjust the crank ring size to adjust to improve chain wrap to a pretty good degree, up to maybe 1/3rd contact. The crank ring is a standard format, so easily swappable.

I think they built this with the assumption that most riders would not be pedaling super hard and therefore limited engagement with the crank ring is OK.

 

[richj8990]

Dang you must be strong! My fat bike (which I'll be putting the motor on) has an 11T and it has NEVER slipped. Maybe chain too long or derailleur spring is weak? Though I must admit my experience is not that great as main bike is belt

No this is a really different chain. If anything it's one link too short actually. It's KMC e11 and I can tell it's not a normal chain lol. When I stop pedaling there is this strong backlurch on the cassette. I can literally feel how strong this chain is through the drivetrain. I'm just doing casual gravel / fire roads with the normal bike. Not like I'm trying to sprint in top gear, not at all. 11t will not take anything more than the absolute lightest pressure on the pedals. The rest of the cassette is OK. I just switched to a 3rd cassette, with 0 miles on it. That should really work.


Update: 11T is fine with zero-mile fresh cassette. Whew. I have two prematurely aged 11T cogs now, just need to remember they can only be on worn chains not fresh ones. It's not easy changing wheels / cassettes between 3 bikes!

 

[jhoexp]

They had a chain guide shown on some of the early photos, would prevent chain from hitting top of chainring. Maybe something to ask about?

They now sell an integrated chain guide mounted close to the pinion gear, and you still can adjust it. I hope it's enough.


I just received my "medium" mount plates, hope they are long enough for my frame, otherwise I'll cut them myself because I can't wait any longer to try this thing.

In the package there was also a ton of small 2mm spacers for the BB and new instructions to mount it.
I'll put it here, it's in Italian, but you all know the basics, right?


I think the picture is self explanatory, but let me know if you want me to translate the rest using football field as unit of measure or other american stuff!

 

[jhoexp]

I just don't think a single chain is going to cut it on this kind of motor. I agree with others that it doesn't look like it's engaging enough teeth at one time especially on the chainring. Two chains would be a lot better, noisier yes but better from a practical point of view. Like, as in it works.

I think the lightest was designed with "normal" mountain biking stuff in mind at EU legal power levels, with some more spice with the 500/750/1000W peak power levels, not as a BBSHD replacement on a cargo bike that pulls 1700W constantly.

I have a BBSHD on a Mongoose boot'r DH frame and never had problems with my 11t cog on a 9 speed cassette, even when pedaling hard uphill at stupidly high speeds.

 

[Chalo]

I have a BBSHD on a Mongoose boot'r DH frame and never had problems with my 11t cog on a 9 speed cassette, even when pedaling hard uphill at stupidly high speeds.

If you measured you chain wear before and after doing that, you might have a different impression. Keep in mind, by the time the chain tends to skip, both it and the affected sprockets are toast.

An 11t or smaller sprocket, even on pedals-only bikes, is something that's nice to have as long as you don't use it much. We went generations without using them (for engineering reasons) before all of a sudden they were on everybody's bikes (for marketing and planned decay reasons).