Trek Lime is NO lemon: video duds #37A and #37 in place now

[Reid Welch]

click to enlarge?






More to come soon: test the magneto for output,
air the Hank, go for a trial ride; then get into the shifter-motor,
then, after that part is understood: mount Hank to the rear.

It is very easy to change the front tire on a LIME: a single, 10mm Allen wrench,
and a pair of plastic tire irons, or just your fingers....on a guitar:

 

[Reid Welch]

The Trek Lime is No Lemon


VIDEO IN UPLOAD WILL BE HERE IN A FEW HOURS.


no edits or scripting, whatsoever. pardon my shake, please? am not well;
it has been a terrible day, and making this video gave me some needed respite from woes and tears.
mike/hydro understands. so does TREK


I love (well, one can only "love" people, not "things") TREK.

TREK is an organization of people, real folks. So there we are.
Please check in again later tonight for the new video? It should be born soon.

 

[Reid Welch]

[youtube]hi17HhgRaRg[/youtube]



"shaky", not "shakey", unless you are into pizzas and burgers in the US of A.
Dyslexia soxs! :wink:

 

[StudEbiker]

Nice video there Reid. I keep intending to do a video, but I haven't got around to it yet. Nice bike. I saw one parked at the local library this week. I really didn't understand what the bike was about until watching this video. Cool idea, but if you want to electrify this ride you are pretty much locked into a cyclone/rc drive type set up right. You have to have that front hub for the transmission to work and obviously there would be no way to put a rear hub motor on it and keep the 3-spd hub.

 

[Reid Welch]

Nice video there Reid. I keep intending to do a video, but I haven't got around to it yet. Nice bike. I saw one parked at the local library this week. I really didn't understand what the bike was about until watching this video. Cool idea, but if you want to electrify this ride you are pretty much locked into a cyclone/rc drive type set up right. You have to have that front hub for the transmission to work and obviously there would be no way to put a rear hub motor on it and keep the 3-spd hub.

Hi, Stud. Thank you for the undeserved compliment. At least I can ad-lib...and...warning:



You have no idea how much I like to say, "Hi, stud!" Especially when the "victim" is thousands of miles
from my glass jaw...ka POW!

Anyway, back to reality, because that above was nothing but a joke. You have to put up with me, like Rodney


dangerfield:


LOOK, STD, the hub dynamo is this MODEL T BIKE's power supply,
because to shift any kind of transmission of any sort of mechanism, requires a small amount of power.
YOU know this, STD, but not all readers are veterans or mechanics or pro bikers, etc.

A family could buy a LIME, and hang it in the garage for twenty years, and when they next ride it: it will shift
because there's no battery, propietary, or "Duracell" alkaline-type, to ever die, nor to leak corrosive electrolyte.

LIME is just like Model T in this respect:
its power system will always work, even a century from now; the hub magneto is incapable of failure, or wearing out, period.

THE NEXT WAVE, coming soon: electrically shifted high-end high performance road, race, trail bikes of any sort of gearing technology.
POINT: they will shift by use of a small, probably lithium, battery, (my guess, go read the Shimano information on the web, various forums?) I speak to the general readers; am not lecturing STD's (ha ha, r. is a clown and clowns are scary!!! VD RISK)

Pro riders are astounded by what this SHIMANO CONCEPT does for them. LIME, though, is the first for the consumer market;
it is like...Model T.

The bikes to come, and TREK will lead, with Shimano doing the engineering, will be VERY SMART in how and when they shift. It's a no-brainer. And if you, dear readers, ever drive an automatic transmission car in traffic whilst thinking of other things, you appreciate how nice it is going to be to just RIDE a bike, instead of having the bike "ride" you.

Electric-drive for this bike? Could be done, but I think I will never do that. I'd have to install a small battery and have circuitry to raise and lower the voltage depending on front or rear wheel speed (think: a spoke magnet and a helping-engineering hand from Justin, maker/inventor of the Cycle Analist.

That is, I =could= but an eZee front motor wheel to this bike, and it would still be automatic, by a simple voltage tapping of the big battery, adjustable to my shift-point likes, all automatic.

Yep. The bike will be ridden more now; I had to wait almost two weeks for the Hanks to arrive, and had the front wheel magneto apart to learn just how simple and beautifully made that unit is. POINT: an automatically shifting bike does not need a hub magneto.
BUT, the beauty of this is: it is so clean, so simple and, it may well operate just as new, even if it were stored away for fifty years.
It is a collectable for the next owner. Me? I won't outlive the LIME. But it is making my dreary life very much better, cheerful, and gives joy that I cannot get from a plain old manual-shift three speeder...you know, I like gadgets that are actually useful!

And too, the bike will go through paces and miles and I will learn of any weak points in the automatic shifting system/execution,
and report here. Remember, this is as significant to the bike world, in its way, as were the first safety bikes of ca. 1889.

It is such a privilege to be one of the first bikers to have such a revolutionary, NEW WAY to bike! And yeah, I could electric-wheel it, for sure! But, for now, and probably forever, I am going to say to myself, K.I.S.S.

Because I am a bit slow on the uptake, you know? (not really, I just like to clown when I am happy)
It was a bad day. That's why the video shakes. But the bike was now just put back to service after being "down" for technical inspection.

The light was right, the bike shifted perfectly as before I took apart the magneto. I did not ride down the street, but only around the courtyard. It's going to be my mental-uplift and mild-exercise bike. People will see it, and I will have a blast telling them about this exciting new thing, first quantum leap in bike technology in 120 years. The next wave is coming, of automatic shifting, soon!
So if you want a complex-geared bike and front braking, and SNAPPY, smart, smooth shifting, you shall have it, guys, pretty soon!

PS: I like, but do not like, the cyclone concept: mechanically not ideal, too much chain and extra fugly parts, and you cannot drive it through deep water. The LIME =could= be dunked and live just fine. Not so with a cyclone-type, as we see those ebikes today.

Never brief, except when I'm in my underwear, and
thanks, StudEbiker, for giving me your perfectly sounded thoughts, and thanks
for looking at this amateur's shaky video of a very trim, light, soundly engineered bike.

It is a guy's bike, not a foo-foo girly thing.
It is masculine, and that's why I got it: it looks all-bike,
no wicker basket or flowers on fenders for me, though John in CR likes that kind of bike (jk).

Kind regards, respectful regards, truly, always,
Reid

 

[StudEbiker]

So Reid just to explain myself a little. I am not being a braggart in my ID. I would have figured you of all the people on here would have picked up on the Studebaker pick up in my avatar. The Studebiker thing is just shifting a vowel. On to your bike though. I know what you are saying about the bike's innovation, it is very trick indeed. Like I was saying I really didn't get what those funny lookin' hubs were about until I read your post. I thought it was a style thing. It is a wonderful advance and it makes me want to go out and try one. However, here in Oregon the hills are what prompted my move to electric and I'm not sure three gears and a coaster brake is the ticket I want. It is very innovative though. I like innovation. You may know this, but John DeLorean while working for Packard Motor Cars helped to develop the first automatic transmission for passenger cars. As for myself....I haven't quite warmed up to the new fangled gear boxes. I've only ever owned one auto shift car a 1979 Z28 (bitchin') Camaro. Talk about being able to pass anything except a gas station! Of the four cars and trucks around the house right now not a single one is auto. When we went to buy my wifes car (2006 Matrix, the newest car we own) the difference in the gas mileage between the auto and the stick was substantial. Which I think is a point that must be a consideration for the Lime. The trade off in not having to do the work of shifting is a decrease in efficiency, and not just because of the resistance of the magneto.

 

[Reid Welch]

Hey, StudEbiker, I GOT the pun. I miss nothing. That is a great screenname and avatar.
I love old cars. For me, a good old car is that or a truck, with room enough in the engine bay
for the mechanic to stand! Remember the Chrysler Slant Six, for instance? My first, no, second car
was maternal g'mother's '61 Dodge Seneca four door sedan. Push button automatic. My god, the room
in those old cars, in the engine compartment, and in the trunk, too: you could stash the contents of a warehouse!

----
YES, agreed! This Lime is not for everybody.

Say, thanks for being a good sport and allowing me to tease you like I did.

Now, this AM, I feel pretty good! I'm truing the front wheel a tiny bit;
rather, making the axle sit perfectly level in the fork. Pictures will show.
See, the new Hank is wider than OEM, and there is a bare millimeter of side clearance
at the fork's crown. But, even though the tire and rim run quite nearly true, within a millimeter:
I have a minor rub. So, I am about to round-file the right side dropout just a bit, to lean the wheel to clear the right crown side.

Pictures to come will be fuzzy, I fear. But you'll see how very neat the front wheel attachment system is!

And now, a flaw report: the Shimano plug and receptacle cannot be relied upon, as assembled by the makers;
the plug is loose and the contacts will oxidize, making a high resistance connection in time.
I have just FIXED that potential problem (plug un-plugging by vibration, and tinning the two wire-ends,
and then it goes back on now TIGHT, and with a heavy dose of silicone plug valve grease to prevent tarnish forever.
See, if we get a high resistance connection in time, the bike cannot possibly shift at the correct points, if at all;
for there would be less and less power getting to the shifter motor.

Pictures will make all this much more clear than my lousy prose.
I am having fun today. I think of the other Reid, though, every ten minutes.
I did not know him, but I know he would enjoy tinkering with even a lemon of a Lime.
We Reids are of a kind: weirdly bold, feckless and often, foolish. But me? Today?
I know exactly what I'm doing and why I am doing it.

Cheers again----tell about your Love, in General? ........The car, dummy! Not HER....ha ha hahaha!

I kid so hard people give me black eyes.

 

[Reid Welch]

Heavily snipped, pardon me, but the point is vital to get across

..the difference in the gas mileage between the auto and the stick was substantial. Which I think is a point that must be a consideration for the Lime. The trade off in not having to do the work of shifting is a decrease in efficiency, and not just because of the resistance of the magneto.

POINT, peeps: The LIME is not an automatic transmission in the sense of the usual auto's auto.
It is a regular, Shimano three-speed, wide-ratio geared hub, MANUALLY shifted, just like all traditional three speed hubs,
but of Shimano quality and design: this hub has been a Shimano mainstay for many years. It is without bugs or fault.

NB: Unless I am mistaken, if the buyer chooses instead, the more upscale LIME, it comes with a five-gear Shimano hub.

For me, here, three speeds are plenty.

All that the "automatic feature" does, therefore, is to pull, or release, tension on a spring-loaded cable that shifts the bike's Shimano rear hub manual transmission.

The "Smart Car" of today works on the same principle: it is an automatically shifted (electric clutch) MANUAL transmission automobile; and they do this mechanically-shifted manual tranny job (not a cross dresser, that car; it only looks girly) to gain, perhaps, ten percent better fuel efficiency, than can be gotten from a fluid-drive torque converter automatic transmission.

Model T, btw, had a fluid-bathed "semi automatic", just no torque converter.
It was, in effect, a virtually automatic transmission car of two forward speeds, plus reverse.
The "servo" motor in this case, was the driver's foot, pressing the left pedal to engage low gear,
releasing left pedal to go into 100% loss-less DIRECT DRIVE, and for reverse: mash the middle pedal.
And if you needed to stop real quick, lock the rear wheels: mash both the left and right pedals at the same time.
Model T stalls and driving tricks are fun: you can roll fore and back with ZERO pause.
I used to freak out drivers at the stop lights: rolling forward, then back, and forward, without any pause or gear shifting whatsoever. "How do you do that?"
"Ask Henry Ford."

Back to Trek track:
now, the POWER needed to PULL the cable, as the bike goes faster and faster, comes from the CURRENT provided by that hub magneto.

It causes a slight drag, but not that the sensitive rider will notice. Three watts is about the output, I reckon, of this magneto,
and so, about six watts, perhaps, at most, and this hypothetical six watts instead of three,
owe to electrical and mechanical losses inherent to any kinetic or electro-machinery,
and said-watts are to be extracted from the rider's leg muscles when he is going, say, 15mph.

At lower speeds, his "power cost" will be less, because the magneto is not outputting as much power;
the shifter-motor "costs" less to maintain the precise one, two, three positions of the shifter cable going to that MANUAL transmission.

Now, that means, by using a magneto instead of a battery, maybe, a ten percent cost of muscular energy, compared against a manually shifted, identical bike.

I am "making up" these numbers, for I have not measured the drag nor the electrical output yet. But I've ridden the bike, in dead-stock form, about twenty miles, and found it to be a nearly perfect delight.
It's flat here, and it, the Lime, is just great fun;

but would be less fun, this, or any biped-aly-only, powered bike, in areas with rolling hills and dales and chipmunks and high winds, even if riding pal-style with Rocky the flying squirrel on your shoulder, and Bullwinkle in a bike trailer behind. Vamoose, moose?
:wink:
Neither Rocky or Bullwinkle or Mr. Peabody or Sherman are here in Miami:
only smooth, level, clean roads.

I miss Rocky & Company.

Video break time! And I do mean to twist history
for the lemon juice, no sugar:

[youtube]kpgJzlY9y8A[/youtube]



PS: Mathurin never backs the wrong horse. He always picks the winner.

 

[StudEbiker]

Okay, I am starting to get a better picture. An electrically shifted standard is a different animal altogether than an automatic. And as you correct;y stated it is the torque converter where much of the efficiency is lost in automatic car. So it is okay to shift the 3-spd Shimano hubs under load? I've only ever ridden one bike that had one on it and that was about the time Urban Cowboy came out so I don't remember much about it. I may have to go down and test drive one of these just to see what it's like. It seems like the ultimate would be to have this set up paired with a Nuvinci type hub though, and that doesn't seem like it would be too difficult to adapt this technology to do just that. Then you would have something that wouldn't shy away from the hills. 8)

P.S. Were you asking about more info about the truck or the Matrix??

 

[WonderProfessor]

I miss Rocky & Company.
Video break time! And I do mean to twist history
for the lemon juice, no sugar:

Oh, Boy! Are you gonna' hear it from the Kristian Republikan Party, the Party of God! We came close to apologizing for the 1953 CIA-backed coup in 1953 during the Clinton Administration. However, for the most part, any discussion of the coup and its long-term ramifications are dismissed as LIBERAL, self-loathing from the Blame American First crowd. According to the Kristian Republikan Party and Fox News, Amerika Iz Never Wrong! I miss the good ol' bespectacled, budget-balancing, socially-progressive, environmental Republican Party. Where's Nelson R. when we need him? He'd go over real well with the Kristian Republikans of today, dontcha' think?

Oh, yeah, I, too, miss Rocky & Company ... as much as I miss being 8 years old.

 

[Reid Welch]

Hi StudEbiker and WonderProfessor. To save your patience, I'll reply to you both in this one form.

addendum: this post has been foreshortened for better readability.

ATTN: TREK FOLKS:
I find that the Shimano plug to the magneto receptacle is far less ideal than it should be;
so simple to make that vital connection RIGHT. It was not right on =my= Lime Lite;
the plug was loose, right off the bat, and about to fall off. That bike would not have shifted for more than five miles,
but, again, QC failed in the poorest way possible: the pot switch was set, by the factory? To the setting "N", for NO SHIFTING.

How many LIMES have been sold, only to come back for refund the next day.
Of course, the LBS can't give a refund; can't afford to, but will fix the minor defect, cheerfully,
which, is great...yet...in the aggrieved customer's mind, his or her Lime purchase, perhaps on impulse,
was an error because the "dead" bike is, to them, even working at last, a harbinger of troubles yet to come.
And they will never buy another Trek. People are that way, we tend to be so disappointed of the new toy which does not work
when it first comes home; and everyone in the 'hood tries it, pronounces this-or-that..but the new thing it don't shift...

...all this leads on to two things: mentally clouded, negative thoughts, bad will for the bike, the LBS, Trek;
perhaps an entire family broken-hearted for a long holiday weekend, staring at the pretty new bike that does not cheer even a one of them. It's all in the mind. But that it what buying a new bike is about: it's a "cheer me up!" purchase.

And this new bike of mine, I got home and rode for ten minutes and it just stayed in low, and this was Saturday night....so, I'm rambling along in words now for a reason: that night, for night is when I like to ride, was very long and lonely. And came Sunday and the pretty bike...it has no voice, no way to tell me "Please note the this little turn slot? Please see that it is set to any clock position of the six or so clicks, other than to "N" OTHING." I'm a GWB Decider and :lol: figure-er-outer.

WHAT about normal people? Have you ever seen nice people turn purple in shame and rage that their new bike on Saturday afternoon, just does not work?

"I want my money back. This is a lemon". "No, so sorry, we'll fix it right now"
Fumes no-one can see or smell, result.
A next-timer soon evaporates. No more Trek brand-loyalty, at all.

:|

 

[Reid Welch]

[youtube]XPd5t0vrJdk[/youtube]

postscript notes that I will probably get annotated into the video:

ALL greasy materials are "dielectric"; meaning, they are electrical insulators.

HOWEVER, if we clean the contacts, AND make the contacts TIGHT, then the oil or grease is "cut through"
and full, perfect mechanical-electrical connection is gained.

USE a silicone "grease". Your local auto parts store sells tiny tubes of "tune up grease" for old time distributor ignition systems;
it is a silicone compound virtually identical to my antique jar of Dow Corning 11 (I bet their engineers will get a kick, seeing this WWII-era material,it could be as old as 1950, or even older, for Dow invented silicone materials during the War. The sailor was throwing the jar away because "It's old and I got a new can of the stuff!" Comedy: Silicone compound (it ain't a true grease) is as inert as any material on earth; it is even in the foods we eat, harmless, does not mix with organic life at all. To see that jar, so old its contents, still EXACTLY in the same state as when it was made so many decades ago, and opened and closed hundreds and hundreds of times by yrs. unruly, over, lo, these many, many years.....

WHAT grease or oil does: EXCLUDES oxygen and corrosion causers such as salt.

WHY not use auto grease? You can, but it's not a sure, long-term bet: most petroleum greases and synthetic greases, too,
contain a myriad of anti-wear additives, some of which TARNISH copper and brass, harmlessly....except that copper oxide
and zinc oxide (brass is alloy of copper and zinc, a terrible conductor), these oxides are nearly totally dielectric.

How many flashlights have you guys thrown away because of their internal contacts going brown, and the light, dim or no-go at all?
Do you know that THEY ALL use spring-brass or steel, nickle plate at best, for contacts and such, or lead daubs?
This is reprehensible, ignorant practice, esp. for premium brand flashlights. "Gold plate" is USELESS except as a tarnish-inhibitor,
FOR A SHORT TIME, for under the micron-thin gold, is nickle plate, which does oxidize, and makes a current barrier,
for all flashlights/torches are rather "high current" devices. I digress worse than the Energizer Bunny hopped up on coke;
sooooooo, be a smart Bugs Bunny and buff, or rub every, every battery you apply to any high-drain-rate device,
for all primary batteries of the flashlight format, are nickle plated at the ends;
don't be anal retentive, just a rough rub on a terrycloth towel at several month intervals, for the light you use most,
rechargeable cell, or throw-away, LEAKY alkaline (old time zinc-chloride primary cells did not leak ever at all).

I digress for a reason! COMMON SENSE can be learned, either by cutting your finger,
or listening to the geyser/geezer who has been there, done that.

MILITARY SPEC of the past, at least, was for BRONZE (copper and tin) contacts in the vacuum tube era, HEAVILY plated with silver.
SILVER WILL OXIDIZE, but, silver is the ONLY metal whose common oxide-forms are PERFECTLY conductive.

Moral? Clamp connections. Exclude air. Exclude wash and rain water. Vaseline? Melts and runs at something like 120F,
and is not nearly so inert or time stable as silicone compounds. But, yes, Vaseline is OK for sealing connections.

Sheldon, gone, but if not, please forgive me for being such a tinhorn lecturer?
Your friend in spirit, I remain,

Hannibal Lecter

I'se hongry!

 

[Reid Welch]

[youtube]rn8s1k3QpPs[/youtube]

curtykillss
August 19, 2007 Trek promoted a critical mass bike ride
full of 1000 Trek Lime bicycles outfitted w/ lights and helmets, check it out!!

Jason, is that all there is of that very costly PR endeavor of two years ago?
Rhetorical question: is that participant's video of any positive help to the bike's image?
Did it, in the two years, nearly, that it has been in view, sell a LIME? Or did it leave all the fruit
at home, to be baked into failbread?

 

[Reid Welch]

"as you can see, that sign says 'closed'. we'll be right back after a word from our sponsors."

fin.

no word ever came back so far as this YT trekker can hear.

 

[Reid Welch]

..and girls did not buy them either. failbread, very pretty looking failbread,
wet, soggy, never rose in the oven,
MARCH 2007
[youtube]6aElHQhNn-4[/youtube]
No mention of the neat automatic shifting of the standard three speed Shimano rear coaster brake hub.

Alberto, the other day confirmed: the pricier Lime is identical to the Lite verison, in that it is also three speeds only.
But it does have an aluminum stem that can be adjusted, rocked back or fore. Don't need that here.
And I sure did not find the cargo seat to be a comfy as the Lite's apparently-leather covered, spring-supported seat.

______________
edits: added data below the sorry, clumsy, Ellen video.
We just have to get a better video up on YT than what is there at present.
People don't buy what they don't understand to be very different than a regular three speed coaster bike.

 

[Reid Welch]

I predict that Reid Welch will alter the shift point of Low
to Medium gear, from the present six or eight mph,
to about four mph.

I further predict that he will, by simple, deductive logic, perfect his LIME to make his own lemonade, very sweet.

This has been Drew Pearson, Reid's first cousin, signing off now, for ever.

Good day, America. The outlook is positive.

 

[Reid Welch]

extraneous yakking cleared by r.w.

 

[Reid Welch]

Not much to report at the moment.
Am looking for Shimano Coasting-specific information,
for now I understand that TEN makers, including Trek, are using this Shimano "package system".
http://www.shimano.com/publish/content/global_cycle/en/us/index/news_and_info/news/shimano_introduces.html

---

http://www.coasting.com/
Click on the "coasting bikes" cloud to see the ten makers' bikes using this Shimano system.

There will be Shimano-official service data to be found
and shown and verbally/video explained, soon. 8)

____________________

I dropped by Coral Way Bike Shop the other day. Alberto confirmed:
there is no Lime or Shimano specific manual for this bike, not even for the Shimano shifting gear,
how to shop-service it, or anything. The bikes are not selling. Poor promotion and NO instructions. True, sorry, Trek.

But there must be some sort of servicing data, so I will ask Shimano direct, in time, if nothing turns up.


----
The Hank over-sized not-OEM tire, that rubbed the front fork crown
because this is a fatter tire than OEM:
an hour or two of work to true the tire, by minor spoke tension adjustments.
And still that was not quite enough to gain clearance, so I did the belt sander butchery
and sanded down the high, sidewall ridge on either side of the tire, to get perfectly free running,
no rubs on the fork crown.
___________________

The Shimano front hub magneto makes very little drag now;
the OEM adustment of the cone bearings might have been a tad tight.
This front hub is not totally free, but its drag is very minor indeed.
I'll show this "drag", inherent, in a soon-to-com video.
__________________

Have just now pulled the chain-side crank. Need more light than I have in order to see; my eyes are weak.
I want to look at the little shifter motor/decider unit, and it appears that the chain cover must come off;
hence, pull the square-hole pedal (I had the right tool for once), and now pull off the chain protector.
Being so poor-sighted, I may have to wait for dawn's daylight to SEE where and how this is fastened.


In the meanwhile, I will study whatever PDF documentation which Shimano has up, online,
in the way of servicing this system.

addendum: HERE is the official Shimano adjustment regimen. Good for DIY'ers, bike shops and gadget-lovers:
http://techdocs.shimano.com/media/t...ervice-Instructions_v1_m56577569830649646.pdf
Download and read it but good. I shall video-explain the basics later.
___________________

It is hoped to be able to fine-tune the shift from low, to M,
and make this shift happen at about 4mph instead of the 6 to 8mph that it presently offers.

Will learn how to remove the rear wheel, and install the other Hank tire.
That one will fit without complication, as the rear fork is so generously wide.
___________________
It was a pleasant surprise to learn that the owners of Coral Way Bike Shop have had the store since 1970 or so,
and I think it was kept by the original, 1942 owners before then.
I'll do a store biography someday when Ismael and Ramon have time to talk;
they are soooooo busy making a living. It is the best bike shop in town, I do think.
Mack Cycle in Miami is also good; I have patronized them since the year 1965.

The Coral Way Bike Shop remains in the same pre-war building it has occupied since 1942.
I like that; it means that my grandfather and his sons must have frequented this shop some sixty five or more years ago.
Same room. No ghosts, though; only hundreds of beautiful, new bikes, of every description and an endless flow of customers,
mostly in for minor servicing of their bikes. Coral Way Bike Shop in Miami may may well be the busiest small shop in town,
I think, because they give everyone a square deal, and they don't butcher parts, nor scratch your shiny bike, nor price- gouge the customers, ever, so far as I know.
___________________
Time will tell, but I think it might be nice for me if I could change the rear sprocket for one with perhaps two fewer teeth,
gearing-up the entire bike, for easier high speed running. It is pretty much a 15mph bike in stock form. For dead level roads,
and no wind, usually, to fight, it could be geared higher for this old pup / weak-legged geezer. :wink:

 

[Reid Welch]

http://bike.shimano.com./publish/content/global_cycle/en/us/index/tech_support/faq_s/nexus_faq_s.html

Is it true that Shimano makes internal hubs that shift by themselves?
Yes, Shimano makes a three and a four speed automatic shifting system called AUTO-D.
The concept is to free the riders from the difficulty of choosing gears and be able to focus on enjoying the ride.
The auto-d system shifts for you by knowing your speed and gearing and selecting the proper gear.

What is Shimano Nexus?
Nexus refers to a group of internally geared hubs and power generating front hubs called "Hub Dynamo".
These componets work great for recreational and everyday riding
whether it is around town or a ride around the park.

Wrong, Shimano. It is a magneto. There is a difference.
This magneto is the most simple and trouble-free of all possible electrical power generators; it just cannot make substantial power,
which is fine here, because all that the shift motor has to do is pull on a cable, trigger at particular points, determined entirely by the
voltage, increasing, of the front wheel magneto putting out more potential and current at increasing speeds.
Again, now that I have been inside the Shimano magneto, I can say: it is first rate KISS design.
I would not want to see brushes for a unit like this, and indeed, the true magneto uses no brushes at all;
it is purely magnetic, no commutation at all, with an output of sort-of-sine-wave, AC, only.

r.w. comments inside the quote with blue font:

Nexus is designed to be simple.
Well, I sure would like to learn how to take it apart and put it back together. Got any service manuals?

a) You can shift gears while pedaling or when at a stop light so you have the correct gear and are ready to go.
Applause! I've an allergy to exposed gearings and gearings that can't be changed except whilst riding;

b) Brake choices: Hand brakes or a coaster brake for simple and familiar braking style.
This one has an internal coaster brake. It works very powerfully.
But will it ever want servicing, like all other multispeed or singlespeed coaster brakehubs?

c) No exposed derailleur to get damaged or bent.
Huzzah for that. I am not an unbiased reviewer at all, ha ha!

Shimano Nexus has three choices: Inter-3 (3-speed), Inter-7 (7-speed) and Inter-8 (8-speed) internally geared hubs.
These hubs come in a variety of configurations with coaster or roller brakes.

There is also the new Alfine 8-speed internal hub which is similar to the Nexus 8-speed hub,
however it has a Center Lock disc rotor mount.

Whoa for a sec? I thought that I just read that the "Auto-D" system came in three speed and FOUR speed versions?
There seems to be a discrepancy in these FAQ texts.

Shimano wants more people to enjoy cycling by creating a family of components
designed for the average person who just wants to ride for fun.
Nexus is perfect for riding with the family, friends,
at the park, down your favorite bike path or running tasks around town.

Well, it is a no-filth system. Good for that. I don't suppose (power losses of spur gearing, etc)
that any internally geared hub can equal derailleur,
IF the derailleur chain is running in a pretty straight line; ie: not the highest gear.
Nexus and Alfine hubs are designed to be simple and durable components that require less maintenance than derailleur gears,
especially in various weather conditions.
Agreed, they have a good reputation. Would be nice to see a PDF of instructions on how to take one down and put it back together,
even if the average home mechanic will ruin the hub in the process! Well, he just goes and buys a new Nexus next, then, (jk, true)

Yes, Nexus is built to last.
It was made to go long periods of time without maintenance
Q: how long, esp. in the coaster brake versions?
and uses specially formulated grease for the severe conditions that any commuter may encounter.

Waiting for daylight so I can get deeper into trouble.
I won't be opening the hub, no way, not today or anytime soon.
But I will get the cover off of the shifter motor and make a lot of pictures of that,
so we may see more or less how it works, what electronic circuitry is in there?
It must, at least, have a rectifier circuit, I'd think. Maybe much more?
Or can the little motor work direct off of the AC of the magneto?
But, if so, how can it know how to "snick" clear and clean (not half-shift)?

 

[Reid Welch]

At first glance, this PDF shows what looks like what the LIME uses:
http://techdocs.shimano.com/media/t...I-Coasting-Front_En_v1_m56577569830649647.pdf

All about the little motor-shifter box, and how to adjust the rear hub's push-pin cable pre-set
http://techdocs.shimano.com/media/t...ervice-Instructions_v1_m56577569830649646.pdf

NB: I just want to make it shift from low to medium at a considerably lower road speed than it shifts in OEM form.
I wonder what I can do toward that end? Mystery Science Theater!


ALL the Shimano tech documents:
http://techdocs.shimano.com/techdoc...older_id=2534374302060519&bmUID=1247738036999

G'day, hth,

and you see now that 'simple' is not really so very simple; just good engineering, is what it is.

And this sort of bike won't be for everyone, I just about bet'cha, Misters ,
(But you knew that already. Fibber's neighbor, Little Girl, she just wanted to drive a point home,
and maybe sell you some cookies for the school picnic fund, prolly; a tummy sinking fund, it is).

:wink:

 

[Reid Welch]

[youtube]nAyzIn3LVSg[/youtube]
Here is a straight talking TREK video, good speaker, talking of the system and the marketing strategy.
Only 600 views in over one year? It's not really a sales video, though.
WHY NOT an official, clean and simple walkabout, and then have a dozen people on a sunny day, try a well-adjusted LIME,
and capture their reactions on camera? Lapel mics, radio mics...."Oh my!" "This bike just shifted to second gear BY ITSELF".

Sell the seasoned sizzle, Trek?

I'm stoked for all the reasons he mentioned so well in the marketing/concept video.
The opening screen is not a good first impression-maker, though, imo.

___________

NOW I'm excited to know, by having now, the official Shimano adjustment directions, see up above?
So, with that arcane information, I should be able to make my LIME shift from low to medium at a lower road speed.
It's all in the adjustments, it seems. And so I should be a super happy Treker, maybe end of today. A new tomorrow.
It's a real boost for my spirits, what with other things going wrong, to have the LIME going strong.

Trek: remember, as my bike was: the pot was set at "N", and NO amount of pedal-speeding would take it out of first gear.
Only when I turned the pot to any of the other clock positions, did the bike shift about right;
now I only need to do the exact factory procedure-adjustments to make the bike shift more "promptly";
ie: that even in "N" it should shift from first to second gear, and this means I won't have to spin up so fast to get my first shift.
And that cheesy Shimano magneto plug connection: sure to give trouble to a LIME owner early on, if my bike is typical:
the plug was barely on its socket, at all. It was about to fall off, just by normal riding! What a demoralizing thing for any, hapless LIME owner, then?
But, lucky me: I'm not hapless nor helpless.

This is no girly bike. I think that's what I most like about it: the styling is superbly neutral, and all "guys' bike if we simply remove the hub "peels";
women would love those, and many males, too...and the charcoal gray peels on my bike are certainly OK looking! But, it is great to just bare the hubs.
This gives the bike such a UNIQUE look (though other Shimano-system makers are using the hubs, bare too. IMO, your peels and color accents ARE the right way,
for most potential buyers.
(I prefer mine without the cute-sy "peels", plain chrome caps),

and I fitted an Incredibell (super bell for bikes, yay!).

And that's about all I am gonna do to this bike.
___________________

Now, have just got the Bontrager Hank on the rear wheel, next to remount the rear wheel,
and then to open the Shimano shifter motor box, make the mechanical "N" adjustment,
and tweak the mechanical adjustment (cable length) at the rear hub by that easy turn screw.

If my energy holds up, I should have a perfectly running (for me, that means quick to shift from first to second gear), LIME

By tinkering, I am sure I can get this bike to be EVERYTHING I want in a neighborhood-to-the-store, bike.

It's just so hard blazing new trails, isn't that so for all of us? I did not design concept or anything, but I'm "blazing" publicity to show that the bike is worthy,
yet, it can be a terrible lemon for the buyer who gets one that is not factory-adjusted just so. Perhaps the LBS should know how to set the N adustment,
etc?

The bike shop has zero experience in setting up a LIME;
no wonder: they are not selling any, hardly a one.

And so, CWBS have no idea of the workings; their business is mostly in traditional bikes,
lots of Treks there! Good old Coral Way Bike Shop. I'll never miss a chance to font their name in blue.
And someday I will "review" that old-school shop, that shop that keeps such a clean workspace, and fixes your bike while you wait.

----------------
A finish her up video of some sort will come. Then a riding demo, showing strangers having a ball on this snick snick snick Lime.
The riding demo will be pretty good looking; I'll tripod the camera, though it is not a very good digicam, it does work OK enough....
sort of like a half-wrongly set-up Lime?

 

[Reid Welch]

I love this bike. It is not perfect.
It is a kool collectors' item that you can hop on and ride in any weather at any time..
NO BRAINS required. I sense that it will not remain in the Trek catalog for much longer;
it is not perfectly executed, due to shortcomings in the Shimano "Coasting" technology;
faults that are NOT of Trek's making.

Again, it is not suitable for hill-and-dale territory; its coaster brake is liable to overheat.
YET, it is super-simple, all BIKE, masculine or girly, just as you like it to look,

and perfect for flat-land runs to the store, or to tour the neighborhoods,
say hello to pretty girls and old ladies, greet dogs on their walks.
It is a happy-go-lucky BIKE that thinks for you: NO levers or shifters needed; nothing on your handlebars;
no levers, no snaky cables, no shxxxite, Sherlocks! :lol: NOTHING EXTRANEOUS THERE
other than a reflector, a ding-bell (Incredibell is best) and a light, if you want to ride at night.

The LIME is a FUN bike. You will see just how much fun it can be, those of you who live in relatively flat territories;
this is not a granny-geared derailleur-failure-dirt magnet bike.

 

[Reid Welch]

_______________________

Stand by for new video, talking a lot, extolling the good and bad points of this wonderful bike.
It costs about half the price of the functionally-similar GIANT DX. It is an excellent value at four or five bills cost.

If my "endurance" holds up, the video will be emplaced here later tonight.
Much to shoot, narrate, edit, upload and share and show, dudes.

This is a GUYS' bike, not an Ipod cutie-wooty. Nobody will say "there goes a geek on a weird bike".
They won't even much want to steal your Lime; it looks just too much like a ho-hum cruiser, but with a twist
of very sweet citrus.

BTW, if they made the "Peels" in a color like an orange, I'd go for that colour.
As it is: I prefer the bare, chrome-plastic Shimano hub covers.

----
Video first segment in the making:
=How to make a phat "Hank" fit within the narrow confines of a LIME's fork crown.
=How air pressure is best determined (by rider weight, by sidewall deflection, by your own choice.
=The higher the pressure of a Hank (35PSI factory max. recommended), the harder the ride, and slightly lower rolling resistance;
a negligible difference from, say 25PSI.

For me, 20 or 25PSI, front, is likely to prove ideal:
maximum shock adsorbtion (your hub bearings and fork bearings will thank you, long term).
=Also, the higher the pressure, the "fatter" the tire grows, and the less "a miss is as good as a mile" effect.

=All we want is that the tire, at its decided-upon air pressure, never will rub that fork crown, and make a harmless,
but annoying, slight drag and scraping noise.

 

[Reid Welch]

#37A to appear here in a few hours, WMM (it's crashing constantly now) willing.

Thank you (NOT) :x , Microsoft D.E.P. design team

D.E.P.
official information for losers like this writer/videographer/Lost-in-Microsoft-space cadet-Land

says reid, sez he:

...As if it's going to actually Publish the video?
Fat freakin' chance...it will hang up, I just about betcha, Misters!
Time will tell. So will about fifteen tries, make this movie "Publish"
without "Windows Movie Maker was Closed...due to D.E.P....."

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
A Popeye Cartoon for time-killing.
All this text and imagery will be replaced with a spanking new perfect (jk) video
of world-rattling :lol: IMPORT. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
_________________________________
TEMPORARY FILLING, SOON TO FALL OUT, (or, NOT)
like (please to click the hy-po-link?) a temporary crown from a decayed toof:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


Popeye...this is his very first feature.
It predates by about four years, the time when he would move,
lock, stock, and Fleischer-barrels, right here to My Home Town.
Yes, the next four years of Popeye. And then many other Fleischer Studio genius-works,
such as "Gulliver's Travels", would be made right 'he-yar:
right here in Miami, right through the year of Our War, 1941::
[youtube]9UjM9UI40jk[/youtube]___________________________________
I yam a former, real, U.S.N. sailor.
An' I yam tougher 'dan six teen
penny nails, is what I yam!
:wink:
r.w.
___________________________________

 

[Reid Welch]

#37A [youtube]sh27NfycR2w[/youtube]

#37B [youtube]zjD2k67hRvc[/youtube]
____________________

Whilst I recharge my biological batteries, I think and ponder it all....
It is late at night here. At, perhaps, around four AM, I shall complete the video trio.
Tomorrow may come a #37D, showing...wonderful things again, that YOU can do better than myself.

In the meanwhile, make figurative love; be happy, under the moon?
[youtube]rHhMe9TON4c[/youtube]
Please to double-click on the player, "HQ", turn off all the room lights
and get out and under the moon? Look, look at the stars above?
____________________

#37C (in WMM processing)
Rubber removal, slight, with a belt sander, plus:
the magic of solvents on rubber, plus the miracle cleaner,
GoJo or its analogues

____________________

#37D yet to be filmed. It will have to wait;
Just three hours ago: a four AM bike crash: a car pulled out of McDonald's.
I was on the sidewalk.
The car driven by a young, working university student, exiting McDonalds, failed to stop at the McDonald's big red stop sign
at the sidewalk exit-area.

Her struck the rear end of the LIME, dumping me into the roadway, "taco"ing the rear wheel,
The rear wheel is ruined. It is so bent that it cannot be rotated by force.
Myself? Not harmed, so far as I can see or feel; only dismayed... and a bit ego-bruised.

Perhaps a new rim will be all that's needed.
I do not think that the frame is bent or damaged, but it is still dark and I cannot see
whether the rear of the frame is bent in any serious way. Aluminum....yikes.

OFF TOMORROW to Coral Way Bike Shop for expert advice.
It should be an easy fix. The poor young lady failed to stop at the exit's stop sign.
I waggled my tactical light at her, and thought she was stopping, but...no.
OFF I rolled from the bike, and into US1 (no traffic, thank my luck).
LIME: inoperable for now; the rear wheel cannot be turned, it is so bent up.
WMM seems to be corrupted, too, and I can't get 37C to "publish".

So it goes, and goes, and...well, there you are: reality suxs.

LATER, after the repairs to come (I'll try to do the re-rim job myself, and not cost her much money),
will then show how the Shimano "Coasting" system shifting motor works and interacts
with the garden-variety Shimano Inter-Three rear hub: L, M, H, gears, automatically shifting
mechanical dog clutches inside the Shimano hub.
Gears are always in mesh, inside any of these sort of units.[/color]