CONSIDERABLE SHOUTING said:Ethanol freezes below 30 degrees F or so, gas doesn't
Ethanol freezing point: -114C / -173F
Methanol -97C / -143F
Gasoline somewhere between -40C to -129C / -40F ... -200F
CONSIDERABLE SHOUTING said:Ethanol freezes below 30 degrees F or so, gas doesn't
minimum said:CONSIDERABLE SHOUTING said:Ethanol freezes below 30 degrees F or so, gas doesn't
Ethanol freezing point: -114C / -173F
Methanol -97C / -143F
Gasoline somewhere between -40C to -129C / -40F ... -200F
Nope ! ..you are missing the key point... which is not just to reduce solar feedback into the grid, .(which they can already control).... or to divert RT solar generation to use behind the meter,..but to increase the load on the grid by forcing Solar owners to consume grid supply instead.jonescg said:Encouraging people to run their hot water systems and charge electric cars in the middle of the day is a far better way to manage it. Shutting off solar is one of many tools in the AEMO bag, and it probably won't get used a lot.
Frankly I see home solar being injected into the grid and general taxpayer being forced to buy it whether they want it or not is as Communist-Stalinist as it gets.Hillhater said:Nope ! ..you are missing the key point... which is not just to reduce solar feedback into the grid, .(which they can already control).... or to divert RT solar generation to use behind the meter,..but to increase the load on the grid by forcing Solar owners to consume grid supply instead.jonescg said:Encouraging people to run their hot water systems and charge electric cars in the middle of the day is a far better way to manage it. Shutting off solar is one of many tools in the AEMO bag, and it probably won't get used a lot.
Anyway, I doubt there will still be many with electric water heaters soon, since the increased power prices have long since made them uneconomical, and those that remain will either be the instantaneous type , or in use with RT Solar owners..so the gains to be had there are not likely to be significant
Charging EVS during the day is logical for some, but the few thousand EVs is minor compared to the 2+ million RT solar systems in use .
To a certain extent that is already happening. BUT........ I see home solar being injected into the grid and general taxpayer being forced to buy it whether they want it or not is as Communist-Stalinist as it gets.......
The grid authorities have not implimented these proposals yet, but they want to do it ASAP. However,to do so , every solar system inverter would need to be upgraded for “smart” functionality.sendler2112 said:It actually sounds like they have done the opposite. They have prevented the home owner the option of using their own power before the meter and forced them to buy from the grid even though they have enough of their own electricity.
The solution to your rant is real time two way smart meters which pay the home owner for their over production only according to the wholesale market price at that time frame. Which might occasionally go negative.
Yes. Generating your own power is exactly like Stalinism.TheBeastie said:Frankly I see home solar being injected into the grid and general taxpayer being forced to buy it whether they want it or not is as Communist-Stalinist as it gets.
OK then. I demand you place the message "go solar NOW" in your .sig.Trump and other leaders has to make censorship equal in seriousness as treason
99.9% of the grid tie installs in the world are single meter bidirectional. No need to shut down anyone's solar power system - all you need to do is switch to net-zero operation for a few hours, which means you can't generate more than you use. And if that still bothers people, you can get small batteries now (to absorb excess energy during that time) for $400/kwhr.sendler2112 said:It actually sounds like they have done the opposite. They have prevented the home owner the option of using their own power before the meter and forced them to buy from the grid even though they have enough of their own electricity.
The solution to your rant is real time two way smart meters which pay the home owner for their over production only according to the wholesale market price at that time frame. Which might occasionally go negative.
JackFlorey said:99.9% of the grid tie installs in the world are single meter bidirectional.
That's what we have. You can get to zero consumption, in which case you still pay a monthly fee. If you go below zero you get "avoided cost" - a few cents per kwhr.sendler2112 said:The "meter runs backwards" situation that many utilities are saddled with are unfair to them in a market system and it is no surprise that they must inevitably push back to something more fair like smart meter real time wholesale pricing.
Again. ..you are not getting the key point.. which Sendler noted and i repeat from before..JackFlorey said:. ..... No need to shut down anyone's solar power system - all you need to do is switch to net-zero operation for a few hours, which means you can't generate more than you use. .......
..but the grid management are looking for more than a financial solution, they NEED to access the LOAD that the peak solar is supplying, in order to maintain grid generation above critical low limits.
I agree that they would like that. They would also like to increase prices by a factor of 10x, since they have a captive market. Regulation prevents that since it's bad for society.Hillhater said:..IE; Grid Authorities would have control over RT solar panels at the INVERTER, and could force solar owners to use grid supply in preference to their own RT solar
Hillhater said:Well, i knew there was some healthy subsidies available for RE, but i am surpriized as the scale , !
Be ready for the wave of denials and crys of ...“not a full picture” ..etc etc.
Yep. For a fun (and insidious) oil subsidy google "depletion allowance." This tax break means they can deduct a percentage of the income from the oil they pump because the well is being "depleted." And even more fun - they can deduct more than 100% of the amount of oil in the well! Sort of an infinite deduction. Whatever oil company executive thought that one up is a genius.jonescg said:Nuclear and thermal generators have received subsidy for about 70 years longer than PV and wind, and have many more MW installed as a result. In fairness, RE will need at least another 30 years worth of subsidy to match it