Bafang M500/M600 thread

[Animalector]

anyone tried loading 48V firmware onto a 43V M600? apparently the coils are wound differently, just curious if anyone had "done it"

 

[CiDi]

anyone tried loading 48V firmware onto a 43V M600? apparently the coils are wound differently, just curious if anyone had "done it"

The motors are the same, it's just a matter of firmware.
I tried 43V firmware with 48V batteries and it works fine except for some overvoltage warnings at the first start with a charged battery.
The 43V battery on 48V firmware also works, but you will not be able to use the full capacity of the battery.

 

[Animalector]

Apparently the coil winding is different (so say Bafang).. I want to reload 48V firmware onto a 43V motor and then use a 48V battery so the battery level indicator is good. Not just use a 48V battery on a stock 43V motor.

 

[casainho]

Apparently the coil winding is different (so say Bafang).. I want to reload 48V firmware onto a 43V motor and then use a 48V battery so the battery level indicator is good. Not just use a 48V battery on a stock 43V motor.

Can you show where Bafang says that?

 

[Animalector]

Haha.. in an email from Bafang. I haven't seen it written anywhere but then again, there's lots of info about these motors that isn't published anywhere

 

[SUPERJC]

there is a good chance that the winding is the same
To find out, you have to measure the RPM/Volt on each engine.

 

[Animalector]

Yeah well I don't have a 48V motor. My first thought was they were the same but if Bafang say they are different they must be different. I'll give it a few days maybe someone here has tried it

 

[SUPERJC]

if possible on the DIY Display it is necessary to plan to put an sd card
it's very interesting to have all the information to improve the settings
Yesterday I participated in a large meeting of difficult mountain bikes
Here is the ebike recording

 

[casainho]

if possible on the DIY Display it is necessary to plan to put an sd card
it's very interesting to have all the information to improve the settings
Yesterday I participated in a large meeting of difficult mountain bikes
Here is the ebike recording

That is a level of complexity that I do not think will ever be done on this EasyDIY display as OpenSource project!! -- but I agree that is really important to have that information and the best option is to have Garmin GPS display doing it or any other app - the only role of EasyDIY display is to provide in real time the motor and battery data, on the ANT+ LEV EBike wireless standard, to make the integration of this motor / EBike on other systems like Garmin or others.

There is a BIG advantage on EasyDIY display to be a small dimension project, that will make possible to finalize the project and get it stable instead of being an endless project.

See the bellow video of an user configuring his Giant Trance EBike (that already has the ANT+ LEV EBike wireless standard), with Wahoo Elemnt GPS display.

I really think the M500/M600 motors lack the ANT+ LEV EBike wireless standard to be on pair of that other expensive brands. BUT, this motors provide all the needed data on the CAN interface, so we just need to implement that missing part:

[youtube]83EHh_EAAUY[/youtube]

 

[Waynemarlow]

Apparently the coil winding is different (so say Bafang).. I want to reload 48V firmware onto a 43V motor and then use a 48V battery so the battery level indicator is good. Not just use a 48V battery on a stock 43V motor.

I'm presuming there are less coil windings on the 43 volt unit than the 48 volt unit. On the TSDZ2 project, the 36 volt motor powered at 48 volts ( and even 52 volts ) was by far the best overall package giving great cadence range and good torque ( not quite as good as the 48 volt motor but near enough ). I'm running my M600 48 volt motor at 52 volts and it spins up nicely where as at 48 volts its not so free spinning.

I know from your Youtube videos that you are a keen cyclist and would I guess have a reasonably high cadence, wouldn't running the 48 volts give you advantages over the standard 43 volt unit of a higher cadence ? The battery indicator is easily got around, just run the battery fully down and look at the battery percentage. I've never yet run my battery fully out ( I have a 800WH battery ) but I know around the 40% mark I need to be heading home and have always got there with about 100WH's left.

 

[casainho]

if possible on the DIY Display it is necessary to plan to put an sd card
it's very interesting to have all the information to improve the settings
Yesterday I participated in a large meeting of difficult mountain bikes
Here is the ebike recording

I really like to do that kind of trips and I am building my new EBike with M500 for that!! Usually I will have available the track file in GPX and then there must be any software that do the calculations in advance for how much battery you will use on that specific route!!! And it can be very complex, including machine learning.

For instance, I also like to run on mountains but I am very limited in my physical capacity. Garmin just launched a new version of their watch Fenix 7, that costs ~1.000€ but has a feature called Stamina -- it needs you to be running sometimes to get your personal running data, sleep quality, stress, etc and then will be able to predict in real time how much Stamina / energy you have and are using and how much more distance (or time) you will be able to run -- it helps a lot you to manage your energy and do not spend to much on some parts, so you can go to the end.

I ended with 7% stamina for only 1 more km, and this really was correct for the way I was felling:




And this metric of Stamina also works for cycling, although Garmin says it is required to have a power meter on the bicycle. I do not know if pedal power value is available on the Bafang display / CAN messages, but I expect it to be, at least should be possible to calculate from the CAN data of the torque sensor (torque and cadence), because torque sensor directly data also arrives on the display!!

 

[CiDi]

Yeah well I don't have a 48V motor. My first thought was they were the same but if Bafang say they are different they must be different. I'll give it a few days maybe someone here has tried it

From the information I have, there are two motor, M500 and M600 and are for voltages 36/43/48V

 

[casainho]

Yeah well I don't have a 48V motor. My first thought was they were the same but if Bafang say they are different they must be different. I'll give it a few days maybe someone here has tried it

From the information I have, there are two motor, M500 and M600 and are for voltages 36/43/48V

Motor stator being sold here, there are no options for different voltages: https://www.greenbikekit.com/bafang-8fun-spare-parts/bafang-m600-m500-motor-with-parts/bafang-m500-g520-motor-stator-for-replacement.html

Although they sell the M500 and you need to choose between the 36/43/48V -- so I would say this are for battery voltages and not the motor:
https://www.greenbikekit.com/bafang-8fun-spare-parts/bafang-m600-m500-motor-with-parts/bafang-m500-g520-torque-motor.html

 

[Animalector]

Yeah well I don't have a 48V motor. My first thought was they were the same but if Bafang say they are different they must be different. I'll give it a few days maybe someone here has tried it

From the information I have, there are two motor, M500 and M600 and are for voltages 36/43/48V

Thanks Mate.

Maybe I'll just give it a go. Could be an expensive lesson.

 

[tomjasz]

Haha.. in an email from Bafang. I haven't seen it written anywhere but then again, there's lots of info about these motors that isn't published anywhere

Would love to see it!!??

 

[Tomblarom]

Anybody opened up the DP-C241 or knows, whether the BT-module is separately attached or they use an nRF instead of STM32 on them? Don't want to kill mine if this there is info about it... :lol:

 

[casainho]

Anybody opened up the DP-C241 or knows, whether the BT-module is separately attached or they use an nRF instead of STM32 on them? Don't want to kill mine if this there is info about it... :lol:

See the pictures of the inside of that display, on the repository: https://github.com/OpenSourceEBike/Bafang_M500_M600/blob/main/Hardware/display_DP_C241.md

On SW102 for instance, you have versions on shops with Bluetooth and others without Bluetooth - still they are all the same, they all have Bluetooth. So I am pretty sure DP-C240 and DP-C241 are the same, even because the DP-C240 has the Bluetooth module inside as seen on the pictures:

 

[CiDi]

Anybody opened up the DP-C241 or knows, whether the BT-module is separately attached or they use an nRF instead of STM32 on them? Don't want to kill mine if this there is info about it... :lol:

You can try to load the DP-C241 firmware and see if it works, but it could be that the BT module is not there.
The photos on the reposity are of my DP-C241.

 

[Bigwheel]

The M600 will run fine on just a simple + -. A few of us have made 21700 batteries and they work fine, in fact very well. My 48 volt unit will start up on the 58.4 volts my charger takes the battery to. I like the 52 volts as the cadence is more like a proper mtb rather than the low speed torque of some of the mid motors.

But the displays will only display battery volts and not the peripheral calculated mileage to go etc. Some displays will show W/hs used so I guess thats just an onward going calculation.

Thanks Wayne.

 

[casainho]

The photos on the reposity are of my DP-C241.

Can you please follow the connections and components about the V+ and VBattery pins??

We need to know what happens to that both signals and the interaction with the power button. Maybe you could follow the connections of the wires and see what type of components there are and the connections. I think you can measure the resistors with a multimeter.

For instance, that 2 traces are probably from V+ and Vbattery - are that resistors or capacitors? and any of that signals go to that mosfet? and is any of the mosfet signal go to the STM32F103? The middle pin of the mosfet seems to go to GND trace.



And here we see resistors in series with every wire, and then 2 diodes. One diode has common path to 2 pins of different connectors.

 

[CiDi]

The photos on the reposity are of my DP-C241.

Can you please follow the connections and components about the V+ and VBattery pins??

We need to know what happens to that both signals and the interaction with the power button. Maybe you could follow the connections of the wires and see what type of components there are and the connections. I think you can measure the resistors with a multimeter.

For instance, that 2 traces are probably from V+ and Vbattery - are that resistors or capacitors? and any of that signals go to that mosfet? and is any of the mosfet signal go to the STM32F103? The middle pin of the mosfet seems to go to GND trace.



And here we see resistors in series with every wire, and then 2 diodes. One diode has common path to 2 pins of different connectors.

I try.

In the meantime, I found an error in the information I had given during switching on and off, I had inverted the P+ with the VCC, these are the correct information.

Off: P+=0V, VCC=Battery+, Can=off

Press the power button for display on:
P+=0V, VCC=2.2V, Can=on

Display on:
P+=Battery+, VCC=2.2V, Can=on

Release the power button:
P+=Battery+, VCC=4.5V, Can=on

Press the power button for display off:
P+=Battery+, VCC=2.2V, Can=on

Display off:
P+=0V, VCC=2.2V, Can=on

Release the power button:
P+=0V, VCC=Battery+, Can=off

I signed the pins, what do you need to know?

 

[casainho]

I signed the pins, what do you need to know?

I need to know how pressing the on/off button changes the VCC from Vbattery to 2.2V or 4.5V.

Please follow the traces to see the VCC trace and what changes on the traces of on/off button that will then change the Vbattery.

Can you measure all the 5 resistors in parallel paths?

See that there is an inductor and IC near, and with array of 4 capacitors in parallel. That are for sure the DC-DC that will take the battery voltage to output 3.3V for the microcontroller, etc.

 

[CiDi]

I signed the pins, what do you need to know?

I need to know how pressing the on/off button changes the VCC from Vbattery to 2.2V or 4.5V.

Please follow the traces to see the VCC trace and what changes on the traces of on/off button that will then change the Vbattery.

Can you measure all the 5 resistors in parallel paths?

See that there is an inductor and IC near, and with array of 4 capacitors in parallel. That are for sure the DC-DC that will take the battery voltage to output 3.3V for the microcontroller, etc.

I am not an electronics expert, please explain to me in detail how I should do it.
How should I make the measurements you need?

 

[casainho]

Please draw colors on the traces, so we can understand where they go. Change the color when there is another component on the path, like that resistors. Measure the values of each that resistors, maybe you can number them and say here their value. For now, let's focus on the Vcc pin and on/off pin.

 

[CiDi]

Please draw colors on the traces, so we can understand where they go. Change the color when there is another component on the path, like that resistors. Measure the values of each that resistors, maybe you can number them and say here their value. For now, let's focus on the Vcc pin and on/off pin.

Are those components capacitors or resistors?