Dear America,

[mark5]

But get a gun so you can protect your family while surfing and whatever else, Dont let any passive or political people let you not protect your family and property, the cops most likely wont get there in time to help so help yourself!! and your family then explain to the cops when they arrive 30 mins later.

what planet do you come from ?

the planet of reality.

Some people, like e-biker, believe they're ultimately responsible for their own protection--can't depend on the police. That's entirely reasonable.

 

[The fingers]

The colonist's motto "ready in a minute". Last time (clue:19 years ago) it took me an hour, but with times being what they are that could be reduced to minutes if need be (as it was during the L.A. riots).
But then again, even seconds are not enough to prepare for a terrorist or nuclear attack. For the last 20 years or so, we have had cops and shooting enthusiests for our next door neighbors. I never felt threatened by either, or more importantly armed intrusion or burglary for that matter; and I am sure the feeling is mutual. However, criminals beware of owner; forget the dog. Raise the threat level and expect a unified, armed community (militia) response; something apparently unique to US culture. If you don't like guns, at least assemble an urban scarecrow or two (a dummy cop complete with uniform, gunbelt, and badge. If it takes a few hits, it is time to shoot back!

 

[TylerDurden]

Gun Show Shootings: At Least 5 Hurt In Accidental Incidents In Ohio, Indiana, North Carolina

AP
01/19/13 10:34 PM ET EST

MEDINA, Ohio — Accidental shootings at gun shows in North Carolina, Indiana and Ohio left five people injured Saturday, the same day that thousands of gun advocates gathered peacefully at state capitals around the U.S. to rally against stricter firearm limits.

At the Dixie Gun and Knife Show in Raleigh, a 12-gauge shotgun discharged as its owner unzipped its case for a law enforcement officer to check at a security entrance, injuring three people, state Agriculture Department spokesman Brian Long said.

Two bystanders were hit by shotgun pellets and taken to a hospital. A retired deputy sheriff suffered a slight hand injury.

The shotgun's owner, 36-year-old Gary Lynn Wilson, brought the weapon to the show to find a private buyer, Long said. Sheriff Donnie Harrison said that it was too early to know whether Wilson might be charged but that it appeared to be an accident.

The North Carolina show, which is held at the state fairgrounds, is a quarterly event that usually draws thousands of people. The two-day show shut down early Saturday but will reopen Sunday.

In Indianapolis, police said a 54-year-old man was injured when he inadvertently shot himself while leaving a gun show.

Emory L. Cozee was loading his .45-caliber semi-automatic when he shot himself in the hand as he was leaving the Indy 1500 Gun and Knife show at the state fairgrounds, state police said. Loaded personal weapons aren't allowed inside the show.

Cozee, of Indianapolis, was hospitalized for treatment. Police say the shooting was accidental and no charges will be filed.

And in Ohio, a gun dealer in Medina was checking out a semi-automatic handgun he had bought Saturday when he accidentally pulled the trigger, injuring his friend, police said. The gun's magazine had been removed from the firearm, but one round remained in the chamber, police said.


Police Chief Pat Berarducci said it appears the bullet ricocheted off the floor and struck the friend in the arm and leg. The man was taken by helicopter to a hospital 30 miles north in Cleveland, Berarducci said. His condition wasn't immediately known.

The gun rallies held Saturday coincide with President Barack Obama's unveiling of a sweeping package of federal gun-control proposals in the wake of a Connecticut elementary school shooting that killed 20 first-graders and six educators last month.

 

[USAEBIKECO]

Neptronix its more than just marajuana. The drug dealers here are more interested in selling crack, meth, heroin, and other really hard stuff. You can never legalize that stuff.

The drug dealers work with or are in the gangs. They get people hooked, then those people hooked go out and commit crimes. Billions of dollars a year is involved in the drug trade here in Chicago. Its very complex. Legaization of mj would bring in money for the city and state but not solve the hard drug problem.

Wanna watch something funny and interesting.. YOUTUBE "Chicago wilcox and francisco" East Garfield Park Camera 398. Watch the whole thing. Its been an open air drug market for decades. There is at least 1 murder a week by handguns close by there. You will see how it is in the hood. Crazy stuff.

 

[neptronix]

Smear piece

Gun shows have been extremely busy right now. People are very scared of gun sales becoming restricted.
Think about how busy those are and how many new gun owners are rushing to get their first gun, and doing stupid crap as a result. 5 is a low number.

What's the accident rate for cars?
We had 410 accidents last week in a population of 3 million when we had a snow storm.

Let's make some other comparisons.
The consumer product safety commission gathers lots of interesting stats.

In 2008, there were 91,000 emergency room visits from saws.

http://www.cpsc.gov/library/foia/foia11/os/statsaws.pdf

In 2010, 317 people died riding ATVs ( this is more than our mass shooting total this year )
Same year, 115,000 were injured.

http://www.cpsc.gov/library/foia/foia12/os/atv2010.pdf

5 people getting injured at gun shows? dude that is nothing.

When you see someone reporting this kinda stuff to smear ebikes, i guarantee you are gonna be just as mad as gun owners are right now.

 

[jonescg]

Nep, I don't want to be the one to point out the problems with making these comparisons.

ATVs, cars, staircases, ebikes, hammers, you name it... all have many uses, all of them perfectly innocent. They can also cause trauma, but this is obviously an unintended use. Guns on the other hand are designed to remove the life of a living organism, and semi-automatics with 30 shot clips and hand guns are designed specifically to remove the life of humans as quickly, stealthily and efficiently as possible. You can't garden with them, you can't use them to drive in a nail, you can't use them water flowers. Sure you could try, but it would be fairly obvious that's not what they were made for.

My point is, if you accept that killing humans is wrong, no matter who is killing who, then surely banning the most effective human-killing guns is a logical step. I'm not saying ban all guns - hunting rifles and shotguns are awesome for hunting game and foul, and if you want to engage in these past times, you should be allowed to. Likewise, the defence forces need guns.

But as for the clowns at gun shows with loaded rifles... some folks can't be helped :lol:

 

[neptronix]

Just making a numbers comparison.

I know, it's different when you put your kid on an ATV and send him off to the sand dunes and he comes back on a stretcher. Or you drive recklessly on ice on your truck and kill your family. Or you leave a candle on at night and burn your house down, etc.. versus someone coming along and shooting your kid or loved one.

I know it's different than gun crime, but there's a tiny bit of danger around us all the time... such is life.

I am not such a pacifist that i think nobody should be allowed to defend themselves. Even Ghandi and the Dalai Lama spoke in favor of using guns as a self defense weapon; it was a no brainer to them.

Taking out ( or disabling and arresting ) someone who is threatening your life, your property, or other lives is your moral right. It's also good for society. If we did not defend ourselves against criminals, crime will get out of hand. Police can't be everywhere. And a lot of people here do not trust the police or our government. You need not look far into our history, and reports of how our police here act to get that. Maybe you'd have to live here to really get it.

I'd love to live in a country that had no guns, and lower levels of violence than here. I'd so much rather someone come at me with a knife, and i could pull out a knife or even just run... but that's just a fantasy! Even you have murders by gun out there.

 

[TylerDurden]

Man accidentally shoots son

 

[neptronix]

Ha, in response to that, i'll leave it on a humorous note tonight..

 

[Sancho's Horse]

Dear...

Always touching to see a disabled man able to pursue his love of hunting (camo hat-must be hunting)

 

[Gow864]

From reading this thread the answer appears simple. How the hell have all you high thinkers missed it? Simply ARM EVERYONE! Make it compulsory for all Americans to openly carry a firearm. Voila! the end of gun violence. Of course the whole "good guy"/"bad guy" thing you'll have to work out for yourself, but as your good guys never go bad once you've sorted that you are laughing.

Good luck with it

 

[Chalo]

But get a gun so you can protect your family while surfing and whatever else, Dont let any passive or political people let you not protect your family and property, the cops most likely wont get there in time to help so help yourself!! and your family then explain to the cops when they arrive 30 mins later.

what planet do you come from ?

Planet Peckerwood, AKA the Red States of America.

 

[liveforphysics]

From reading this thread the answer appears simple. How the hell have all you high thinkers missed it? Simply ARM EVERYONE! Make it compulsory for all Americans to openly carry a firearm. Voila! the end of gun violence. Of course the whole "good guy"/"bad guy" thing you'll have to work out for yourself, but as your good guys never go bad once you've sorted that you are laughing.

Good luck with it

Tell me who the good guys are Gow864.
Also tell me who the bad guys are.

Its a fun exercise to take a look at good and evil and who causes the most harms and who imposes their will against others the most sometimes.

 

[Dauntless]

From reading this thread the answer appears simple. How the hell have all you high thinkers missed it? Simply ARM EVERYONE! Make it compulsory for all Americans to openly carry a firearm.

A proven track record of success.

Gun Ownership - It's The
Law In Kennesaw
By Jonathan Hamilton and David Burch
Marietta Daily Journal Staff Writers

KENNESAW, Ga - Several Kennesaw officials attribute a drop in crime in the city over the past two decades to a law that requires residents to have a gun in the house.

In 1982, the Kennesaw City Council unanimously passed a law requiring heads of households to own at least one firearm with ammunition.

The ordinance states the gun law is needed to "protect the safety, security and general welfare of the city and its inhabitants."

Then-councilman J.O. Stephenson said after the ordinance was passed, everyone "went crazy."

"People all over the country said there would be shootings in the street and violence in homes," he said. "Of course, that wasn't the case."

In fact, according to Stephenson, it caused the crime rate in the city to plunge.

Kennesaw Historical Society president Robert Jones said following the law's passage, the crime rate dropped 89 percent in the city, compared to the modest 10 percent drop statewide.

"It did drop after it was passed," he said. "After it initially dropped, it has stayed at the same low level for the past 16 years."

Mayor Leonard Church was not in office when the law was passed, but he said he is a staunch supporter of it.

"You can't argue with the fact that Kennesaw has the lowest crime rate of any city our size in the country," said Church, who owns a denture-making company in Kennesaw.

The author of the ordinance, local attorney Fred Bentley Sr., attributes at least some of the decrease in crime to the bill.

"I am definitely in favor of what we did," he said. "It may not be totally responsible for the decrease, [but] it is a part."

Although he is pleased with the outcome, Bentley said he was originally opposed to drafting the law.

"I didn't think it could be written in a constitutional fashion," he said. "Obviously, it was constitutional, because the American Civil Liberties Union challenged it in court and we won."

Jones said the ACLU challenged the law in a federal court just after it was passed. In response, the city added a clause adding conscientious objectors to the list of those exempt.

Although the law is now being credited with a drop in crime, Jones said that was not the law's original purpose. He also pointed out that Kennesaw did not have a big problem with crime before.

"The crime rate wasn't that high to start with. It was 11 burglaries per 1,000 residents in 1981," he said.

According to the Kennesaw Police Department, the city's most recent crime statistics show 243 property crimes per 100,000 residents in 1998, or .243 per 1,000.

The city's crime rate continues to be far below other metro Atlanta city's with similar populations, like Decatur. In 1998, Decatur recorded 4,049 property crimes per 100,000 residents.

Jones said one motivation for the council passing the ordinance had to do with publicity.

"It was done in response to a law passed by Morton Grove, Ill., outlawing gun ownership within the city limits," he said. "Several council members were upset Morton Grove had gotten a lot of attention with their ordinance so they decided to top them.

"They figured the gun ownership ordinance would knock that city right off the front pages. They were right."

Jones said the ensuing publicity surrounding the law has given Kennesaw worldwide name recognition.

"I have been to Australia and Europe and when I tell people I am from Kennesaw they recognize the name as the place that requires everyone to own a gun," he said.

But Stephenson said the issue was not publicity-driven but issue-driven.

"We believed in the right of people to own guns," he said.

Jones said he has sold 550 copies of a 1994 book about the first-of-its-kind law, "The Law Heard 'Round the World."

He said the law in its final form has many loopholes, so not everyone is required to own a gun.

"There are many outs," he said. "When you look at it, almost anyone could fit into one of the exempted groups."

Kennesaw Police Chief Dwaine Wilson said no one has ever been prosecuted under the ordinance.

Among those exempt are residents "who conscientiously oppose maintaining firearms as a result of beliefs or religious doctrine." Others exempt include the physically and mentally disabled, paupers and those convicted of a felony.

The law contains no clause addressing punishment for violating the law. If convicted, City Clerk Diane Coker said punishment would be determined by the general penalty clause of the Kennesaw Code Ordinance - probably a fine of about $100.

Jones said the unusual law has not deterred anyone from moving to Kennesaw.

"Our population has increased just like everyone's in Georgia in the past 20 years," he said. "The law really hasn't done any harm to the city's growth."

The city's population in 1998 was recorded at 14,493 - a sharp increase over the 8,936 residents recorded in the 1990 census.

Cobb Chamber of Commerce president Bill Cooper said odd laws are typically not counted as strike against a city when a business is looking to relocate.

"These laws don't have laws don't have an impact on a company's decision to move to Cobb County," Cooper said.

"Many communities have strange laws that are out of date. Businesses look at many factors when relocating, such as quality of life, education, infrastructure and available workforce."

Bentley said the law actually may have helped business development.

"Kennesaw is home to more manufacturing businesses than any other Cobb city," he said. "Companies have said they want to be located in conservative areas."

And Kennesaw isn't the only city in Cobb with an unusual law on the books.

According to Jeff Koon, who runs a Web site specializing in funny laws, Dumblaws.com, Acworth has a ordinance requiring residents to own a rake.

In Marietta, it is illegal to spit from a car or a bus, but perfectly legal to spit from a truck.

 

[Gow864]

From reading this thread the answer appears simple. How the hell have all you high thinkers missed it? Simply ARM EVERYONE! Make it compulsory for all Americans to openly carry a firearm. Voila! the end of gun violence. Of course the whole "good guy"/"bad guy" thing you'll have to work out for yourself, but as your good guys never go bad once you've sorted that you are laughing.

Good luck with it

Tell me who the good guys are Gow864.
Also tell me who the bad guys are.

Its a fun exercise to take a look at good and evil and who causes the most harms and who imposes their will against others the most sometimes.

Can't help you there mate. I'll bet the NRA could though......


Being serious for a mo. From where I stand a lot of governments around the world seem to have become little more that public relations departments for the corporations that run them. Monsanto, Santos, BHP etc. etc. Meanwhile the masses squabble (this thread) over things they can have no bearing over. Divide and conquer. Still working a charm.

Completely left field from this thread. There is no requirement to label meat from cloned animals as "cloned" in the US. Check the depts involved and you will find that dept loaded with ex Monsanto employees. Corporations running your government for their profit.
So, LFP you are right to worry about who the good and bad guys are. Enjoy your meal... no need to tip.

 

[bigmoose]

Completely left field from this thread. There is no requirement to label meat from cloned animals as "cloned" in the US.

I'm not so sure it is irrelevant... I spent all day yesterday 100 miles east in the Amish community visiting, and meeting no GMO usage beef, chicken, and pork providers. One of the men, who we are going to a livestock auction with in February, told us that there will likely be a Bob Evans sausage buyer at the pig auction... he went on to say for us to watch which old boars he typically bought. He then told us how a company might take certain pig meat that is not premium and process it to look premium and sell at a premium price. He then went into the processing of hot dogs and bologna... it isn't a pretty picture. We are so removed from reality on so many levels these days...

 

[Philistine]

How do you find the hands of evil in the world? You listen for the chorus of, "I'm sorry, the laws is the law", or "I was just obeying orders."

I truly pity these poor confused souls. If you're going to choose to live in imaginary fantasy world where an invisible force ('authority' and 'orders') controls your actions, at least have the sense to make your fantasy world something fun and exciting. Like the invisible force that controls your actions tells you to appreciate nature or go surfing or something fun rather than imprison/kill/bomb people.

That was magic, I would say I couldn't have said it better myself, but I would have replaced "something fun" with "smoke crack and have anal sex" or "pay a hooker to cut off a Bondi Cigar in your mouth", but then again, I just realised this isn't the Biker Bar, so I guess you did say it much better than me.... I'll get my coat....

 

[Dauntless]

How do you find the hands of evil in the world? You listen for the chorus of, "I'm sorry, the laws is the law", or "I was just obeying orders."

. . . . I would have replaced "something fun" with "smoke crack and have anal sex" or "pay a hooker to cut off a Bondi Cigar in your mouth". . . .

Not so fast. Everyone, ABSOLUTELY EVERYONE, has their moment of that. There are those who are quick to take advantage. But I would also add there are those who are quick to point the finger as they try to convince you of the evils of others who've done nothing wrong because they themselves seek to do evil. Those are highly evil.

But this from someone who has always been the little boy who doesn't see the emperors new clothes. A lot of finger pointing comes from those in that particular coverup.

Tell me who the good guys are Gow864.
Also tell me who the bad guys are.

Its a fun exercise to take a look at good and evil and who causes the most harms and who imposes their will against others the most sometimes.

No, it won't be fun. Evil will assault you. Look at how evil responded to the immigrant that decried Obama's welfare Juggernaut before the election. Then there's the guy whose wife was killed by an illegal immigrant just before a certain Arizona law was passed, who was then threatened and terrorized by evil for his speaking up. Evil is as evil does.

NEVER allow anyone to tell you what is evil. More important, don't let them tell you what is NOT evil. But if you want a good yardstick to influence you a bit, watch for the fingerpointing as well as the denials. Obama engages in both. When President James Garfield was assassinated by a relative insider from his campaign, the very first words from the Vice President were "I HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH IT." This from a man who just a few years before the election was fired from a government job for taking his share of the graft to the tune of more than 20 times his paycheck. Doesn't prove anything, but what do you think?

. . . I would have replaced "something fun" with "smoke crack and have anal sex" or "pay a hooker to cut off a Bondi Cigar in your mouth". . . .

Some people do replace fun with drugs, some with videogames, etc. The question is which one will influence someone to go out and do evil to others?

what planet do you come from ?

Planet Peckerwood, AKA the Red States of America.

We know. Besides, he was asking e-biker.

 

[Philistine]

Philistine wrote:
. . . I would have replaced "something fun" with "smoke crack and have anal sex" or "pay a hooker to cut off a Bondi Cigar in your mouth". . . .


Some people do replace fun with drugs, some with videogames, etc. The question is which one will influence someone to go out and do evil to others? (Crack, etc.)

When you raise people right they make the right choice

 

[neptronix]

When you raise people right they make the right choice

yup
yup
yup
yup

 

[Toorbough ULL-Zeveigh]

Guns are for giving us erections!

well, most prefer the porneau.
but whatever rocx yer whirrled, here yago.

geez, get a grip!
yule b mor relaxed.
[youtube]bwKl-Ng084U[/youtube]

 

[nicobie]

I was going to add to the discussion but it's kinda hard to follow that post...

 

[Dauntless]

When you raise people right they make the right choice

You really think you're seeing a lot of 'Raising' going on these days?

And even kids that are raised right still choose drugs with their friends at a young age. There are limits to what you can really do, an individual is responsible for a lot more than some are willing to acknowledge. A brother and I both grew up around the substance abuse in our family, both saying 'I won't be doing any of that.' Only one followed through. Why the other didn't not even he can explain.

I was going to add to the discussion but it's kinda hard to follow that post...

So you just give up?

geez, get a grip!
yule b mor relaxed.

If you want someone to chill, you gotta give them a more chilllike video. Some of us aren't into the sort of women in yours, anyway.

[youtube]Yis2fBqYQro[/youtube]

 

[Philistine]

Philistine wrote:
When you raise people right they make the right choice


You really think you're seeing a lot of 'Raising' going on these days?

frock off, I was drunk and high when I wrote that last night, now I am sober as a judge, and about to walk out the door to take my kids to an award winning Science discovery place, until I get high after dinner tonight I am a model dad doing awesome child rearing, those kids will have no idea their dad is burnt by reality until the weight of the world crushes their soul in turn.

 

[Dauntless]

frock off, I was drunk and high when I wrote that last night, now I am sober as a judge, and about to walk out the door to take my kids to an award winning Science discovery place, until I get high after dinner tonight I am a model dad doing awesome child rearing, those kids will have no idea their dad is burnt by reality until the weight of the world crushes their soul in turn.

Huh?